Previous Thread
Previous
Expand All
Collapse All
Ignore Author
Reply
Holy Magic in general, should be at somewhat of a merger. There are a lot of spells that Clerics have that I think would be equally, if not more, Suitable for Paladins. As the same for Paladins, there are a few (*Note: few, being that Paladins have few spells already, can't have a lot from a little?).... that seem to be equally, if not better, for Clerics.
I personally Would like to see a couple Paladin and Cleric books merge, while others stay Paladin/Cleric only. I understand that the soul-system would make it hard for a paladin spell to calculate properly under clerical cast, but wouldn't a cleric's Devotion be able to act in the code for the soul of a Paladin?
As far as Combattive Holy magic, i think it would be proper if offensive type spells that hurt the target should be severely decreased, if not nulified, when casting upon a righteous follower of teh Immortals.
Our two guilds are Directly under the Immortals. Our magic comes from them, and so does our abilities. While the Smites are not released for PvP, but hopefully someday the P-Team will 'deem us worthy', and remove that stupid compact and let Smites be used in PvP, at such a time - They should be useless vs a Cleric, or another Paladin. (with the exception the Paladin has black soul - or equivalent [if any?] of a cleric).
~ Teh Solo Hunta
>>Holy Magic in general, should be at somewhat of a merger
This could be said for all mana...not just holy.
I also think that the 'way' a guild taps or uses the mana is what make it different and near impossible to learn or use.
Perhaps for those using the same mana type, can learn a scroll if they have the scholarship, regardless of tier...then we'd have palies walking around with the raise spell...
Crusinix
"Freedom lies within an unconstrained mind"
This could be said for all mana...not just holy.
I also think that the 'way' a guild taps or uses the mana is what make it different and near impossible to learn or use.
Perhaps for those using the same mana type, can learn a scroll if they have the scholarship, regardless of tier...then we'd have palies walking around with the raise spell...
Crusinix
"Freedom lies within an unconstrained mind"
<<Holy Magic in general, should be at somewhat of a merger. There are a lot of spells that Clerics have that I think would be equally, if not more, Suitable for Paladins>>
SoL and CoZ, maybe? I think CoZ, being a curse, is clean cut us. SoL is debatable.
<<As the same for Paladins, there are a few (*Note: few, being that Paladins have few spells already, can't have a lot from a little?).... that seem to be equally, if not better, for Clerics.>>
What spell, MO? That's all I can think of...but heck, if you wanna give me anti stun or something, cool.
<<I personally Would like to see a couple Paladin and Cleric books merge,>>
I mean no offense by the following statement, but I wouldn't hold my breath for a merger.
SoL and CoZ, maybe? I think CoZ, being a curse, is clean cut us. SoL is debatable.
<<As the same for Paladins, there are a few (*Note: few, being that Paladins have few spells already, can't have a lot from a little?).... that seem to be equally, if not better, for Clerics.>>
What spell, MO? That's all I can think of...but heck, if you wanna give me anti stun or something, cool.
<<I personally Would like to see a couple Paladin and Cleric books merge,>>
I mean no offense by the following statement, but I wouldn't hold my breath for a merger.
I see none of our clerical spells suitable for paladins. We are much more intensively trained in the ways of holy magic. Do you think Zachriedek would really let a paladin use his curse? And... our only attack spell (AE) is already weak as it is, weakening it more will just make it a fiery show. (Ohhh, look! it's raining holy bolts of destruction!!!)
However, a new book for both clerics and paladins might be acceptable. Maybe a new magic type in the Arcane Magic category. (Shamanic Magic??)
~a priest of Kerenhappuch
However, a new book for both clerics and paladins might be acceptable. Maybe a new magic type in the Arcane Magic category. (Shamanic Magic??)
~a priest of Kerenhappuch
>it would be nice to get the shield of light (paladins asked for it originally)
And Clerics still have the highest shield req in the game. Clerics were once viewed as the shield users of the realms. A large part of the reason that shield is so prevalent amount Paladins and not Clerics is
1) its primary for Paladins, and actually easy to learn, and
2) It was much easier to learn than basic armor, so it was what a lot of people used to circle.
That's just a guild argument.
The other argument why Clerics should keep the spell is that the Clerics make light into solid objects. DR creates a solid object that impacts the creature we hit, knocking it off balance. Halo creates a solid wall of light that knocks away creatures. Clerics can turn light into a shield, it's not that much of a stretch given the other two things clerics can do with the so-called 'holy light'.
No matter what anyone says on the issue though.. I'm sure the spell won't change hands. It was complained about and asked for originally after the spell came out, and as we can all see the spell didn't change hands during the change to the new magic system. If the spell were to change hands, it would have happened during the magic transition. The spell will remain for Clerics.
And Clerics still have the highest shield req in the game. Clerics were once viewed as the shield users of the realms. A large part of the reason that shield is so prevalent amount Paladins and not Clerics is
1) its primary for Paladins, and actually easy to learn, and
2) It was much easier to learn than basic armor, so it was what a lot of people used to circle.
That's just a guild argument.
The other argument why Clerics should keep the spell is that the Clerics make light into solid objects. DR creates a solid object that impacts the creature we hit, knocking it off balance. Halo creates a solid wall of light that knocks away creatures. Clerics can turn light into a shield, it's not that much of a stretch given the other two things clerics can do with the so-called 'holy light'.
No matter what anyone says on the issue though.. I'm sure the spell won't change hands. It was complained about and asked for originally after the spell came out, and as we can all see the spell didn't change hands during the change to the new magic system. If the spell were to change hands, it would have happened during the magic transition. The spell will remain for Clerics.
>>(paladins asked for it originally)<<
I [Cleric] presented the Soldier's Prayer spell that was later added to the Paladin Guild's planned spell list (with a slight change to functionality but no change in the name). I don't care about it, but it demonstrates that there are no squatters rights when it comes to spells.
Lainn
I [Cleric] presented the Soldier's Prayer spell that was later added to the Paladin Guild's planned spell list (with a slight change to functionality but no change in the name). I don't care about it, but it demonstrates that there are no squatters rights when it comes to spells.
Lainn
Actually I would think if you were a guild that doesn't cast much magic in combat- then SOL would be just fine without OM.
But its ours and I dont' want to give it up, except maybe for a trade- they can share SOL if we can share courage.
Actually there was a discussion a year or two ago about shared spells for our guild- with the emphasis on new spells that would be shared but would have differant effects for each guild, and improved effects when jointly cast. I love that idea.
Flavius
But its ours and I dont' want to give it up, except maybe for a trade- they can share SOL if we can share courage.
Actually there was a discussion a year or two ago about shared spells for our guild- with the emphasis on new spells that would be shared but would have differant effects for each guild, and improved effects when jointly cast. I love that idea.
Flavius
>Isn't 'light manipulation' supposed to be Moon Magies area? Give SoL to moon mages!
Sticky subject, I agree. HOLY LIGHT, as it is described by all of our light based spells, is obviously our area. Other light sorts of things is Moon Mages. Just because it uses the word 'light' doesn't mean it instantly 'belongs' to Moon Mages.
Sticky subject, I agree. HOLY LIGHT, as it is described by all of our light based spells, is obviously our area. Other light sorts of things is Moon Mages. Just because it uses the word 'light' doesn't mean it instantly 'belongs' to Moon Mages.
I don't think sharing certain spells is a terrible idea.
I, as a paladin, would never want to see a paladin with resurrection, but I don't see why a paladin couldn't have rejuv. I'd personally only like two spells of the clerics, SoL and Centering. Perhaps just make a really high level req for a paladin to get access to some minor cleric spells and vice versa.
Litharius
I, as a paladin, would never want to see a paladin with resurrection, but I don't see why a paladin couldn't have rejuv. I'd personally only like two spells of the clerics, SoL and Centering. Perhaps just make a really high level req for a paladin to get access to some minor cleric spells and vice versa.
Litharius
>>I honestly don't see any reason why anyone should be immune to any type of mana spells, regardless of what type they themselves use.
Protection from Evil helps protect against holy mana spells.
>>again, it's almost useless without OM.
Hardly. This and centering were the only spells I used, other than when needing to use HE. It's more of a "battle" cleric spell I think than a "Mage" cleric...even though I concider myself more of a mage.
>>I, as a paladin, would never want to see a paladin with resurrection, but I don't see why a paladin couldn't have rejuv. I'd personally only like two spells of the clerics, SoL and
Centering. Perhaps just make a really high level req for a paladin to get access to some minor cleric spells and vice
versa.
Centering needs Rejuve, and possibly Soul Bond before it can be chosen. SOL needs DR and I think PFE (Not sure on sol) but neither one are concidered minor spells.
Honestly the greedy part of me is like "No, no...we have more magic slots, therefore we will have more spells to come out, where as palies will have more to gain."
The more open part of me is like "Would make interesting possiblities and spell combinations, increase spell book size..."
I doubt it would be "go to your guild leader and ask to be taught this spell"...it would probably have to be memoriezed off a scroll, which gives more use to the scroll system...
Then again, i'm of the mind to let bards go ahead and memorize GG as well, in exchange for something, like vocal range or something...
Ah, just go for the whole shabang...let everyone have the ability to memorize a scroll, regardless of guild...if you memorize a spell (which uses a spell slot and TDP) and you backfire 95.5% of the time because of incompatable mana...well, tough cookies for you, should have just tried to decipher it first...
Dark Angel Crusinix
"Lives are measured by impact...not lenght"
Protection from Evil helps protect against holy mana spells.
>>again, it's almost useless without OM.
Hardly. This and centering were the only spells I used, other than when needing to use HE. It's more of a "battle" cleric spell I think than a "Mage" cleric...even though I concider myself more of a mage.
>>I, as a paladin, would never want to see a paladin with resurrection, but I don't see why a paladin couldn't have rejuv. I'd personally only like two spells of the clerics, SoL and
Centering. Perhaps just make a really high level req for a paladin to get access to some minor cleric spells and vice
versa.
Centering needs Rejuve, and possibly Soul Bond before it can be chosen. SOL needs DR and I think PFE (Not sure on sol) but neither one are concidered minor spells.
Honestly the greedy part of me is like "No, no...we have more magic slots, therefore we will have more spells to come out, where as palies will have more to gain."
The more open part of me is like "Would make interesting possiblities and spell combinations, increase spell book size..."
I doubt it would be "go to your guild leader and ask to be taught this spell"...it would probably have to be memoriezed off a scroll, which gives more use to the scroll system...
Then again, i'm of the mind to let bards go ahead and memorize GG as well, in exchange for something, like vocal range or something...
Ah, just go for the whole shabang...let everyone have the ability to memorize a scroll, regardless of guild...if you memorize a spell (which uses a spell slot and TDP) and you backfire 95.5% of the time because of incompatable mana...well, tough cookies for you, should have just tried to decipher it first...
Dark Angel Crusinix
"Lives are measured by impact...not lenght"
Where the hell did this go? I never asked to TAKE spells FROM clerics and put em in Paladin books? I suggested sharing books. Certain Spells. Marshal Order is a spell I would think Paladin-Only, anything from the Sacrifice Book (if its ever released?) Paladin only, - most other spells I think should be shared w/ CLerics. As are a lot of combat spells Clerics have, I think should be shared w/ Paladins.
I DON"T think Res should be a Paladin thing - Though up until 2 minutes ago when I asked a buddy, I was always under the impression Ressurection was an ability, not a spell (since You have to go on the quest for it) Rejuve would be nice, but I don't really see that as a Paladin-thing. I think spells like SoL, Centering, Bless, HE - those are spells I think would be a good thing to share. I don't think a COMPLETE murger of books would be good (All spells in X book), Put in some restrictions.
... and as far as "Clerics have the highest Shield Req' .. Thats such a lame argument, what the hell? You have to get 51 ranks of shield, omg, thats SOOO hard. Thats no excuse to say 'oh ya we should have SoL because like we have to do 51 in shield'.. Now, the thing about bendin light was a good argument that makes me really think about maybe the spells shouldn't be shared...
.And now - to the Immune to Holy. Holy Magic is WAY different from Elemental, or Lunar. Holy Magic comes from the Immortals. Those immortals empower the Clerics and Paladins to use their energy. I would think that BECAUSE Holy Magic Comes with restrictions (Devotion[kinda], Soul), that it would be more powerful. Now to go back tot he point of argument, A Paladin, Calling upon the Immortals to cast a <harmful/attack> spell against one of the Immortals very own DEVOUTE followers, You really think theyd be like 'Ya ok go ahead and kill that person, I really didnt' like the way he prayed to me anyhow.'
No, And same goes for Clerics vs Paladins. We SHOULD be held to a higher expectation than some Warrior Mage. That is all for now.
~ Teh Solo Hunta
I DON"T think Res should be a Paladin thing - Though up until 2 minutes ago when I asked a buddy, I was always under the impression Ressurection was an ability, not a spell (since You have to go on the quest for it) Rejuve would be nice, but I don't really see that as a Paladin-thing. I think spells like SoL, Centering, Bless, HE - those are spells I think would be a good thing to share. I don't think a COMPLETE murger of books would be good (All spells in X book), Put in some restrictions.
... and as far as "Clerics have the highest Shield Req' .. Thats such a lame argument, what the hell? You have to get 51 ranks of shield, omg, thats SOOO hard. Thats no excuse to say 'oh ya we should have SoL because like we have to do 51 in shield'.. Now, the thing about bendin light was a good argument that makes me really think about maybe the spells shouldn't be shared...
.And now - to the Immune to Holy. Holy Magic is WAY different from Elemental, or Lunar. Holy Magic comes from the Immortals. Those immortals empower the Clerics and Paladins to use their energy. I would think that BECAUSE Holy Magic Comes with restrictions (Devotion[kinda], Soul), that it would be more powerful. Now to go back tot he point of argument, A Paladin, Calling upon the Immortals to cast a <harmful/attack> spell against one of the Immortals very own DEVOUTE followers, You really think theyd be like 'Ya ok go ahead and kill that person, I really didnt' like the way he prayed to me anyhow.'
No, And same goes for Clerics vs Paladins. We SHOULD be held to a higher expectation than some Warrior Mage. That is all for now.
~ Teh Solo Hunta
>>>>>>>>Where the hell did this go? I never asked to TAKE spells FROM clerics and put em in Paladin books? I suggested sharing books. Certain Spells. Marshal Order is a spell I would think Paladin-Only, anything from the Sacrifice Book (if its ever released?) Paladin only, - most other spells I think should be shared w/ CLerics. As are a lot of combat spells Clerics have, I think should be shared w/ Paladins<<<<<
Why should we share books at all? It sounds like you want access to all the cleric spells that would supplement paladin spells.
>>>>> I DON"T think Res should be a Paladin thing - Though up until 2 minutes ago when I asked a buddy, I was always under the impression Ressurection was an ability, not a spell (since You have to go on the quest for it) Rejuve would be nice, but I don't really see that as a Paladin-thing. I think spells like SoL, Centering, Bless, HE - those are spells I think would be a good thing to share. I don't think a COMPLETE murger of books would be good (All spells in X book), Put in some restrictions.<<<<<
Resurrection was a spell. What it is in the future is anyone's guess. Lets see Centering uses spiritual magic to center me. Paladins have a balance spell already but if I remember correctly it costs soul so having Center means you don't have to use soul for it. Bless. Hmm let's see, paladins over 50th can quest for a holy weapon but it takes time to recharge it and time to get it. Bless means they don't have to do any of that. Harm Evil. Hmm seems like smite and shatter affect undead but take a lot of mana. Harm evil gives them a targetted spell for a tert guild. Hrrm ok let's not even go there. Shield of Light. Let's see paladins get a bonus to learning armor and stances after 10th they get an extra point every ten circles towards stance. Shield of Light creates shields that are lighter and better made then ordinary shields and give a bonus when used against undead. Hmm. Armor primary and a shield of light.
Ok so what we have here is a paladin who can target undead using a shield of light with a self blessed weapon who's balance will come back to solid faster. Hrrm Anyone see any problems with this?
>>>> ... and as far as "Clerics have the highest Shield Req' .. Thats such a lame argument, what the hell? You have to get 51 ranks of shield, omg, thats SOOO hard. Thats no excuse to say 'oh ya we should have SoL because like we have to do 51 in shield'.. Now, the thing about bendin light was a good argument that makes me really think about maybe the spells shouldn't be shared...><<<<<<<<,
Clerics have the highest amount of required ranks compared to any other guild. We have to learn 51 ranks in a tert skill. And when I learned my first 51 ranks was way before shield became viable to train.
>>>>>>> .And now - to the Immune to Holy. Holy Magic is WAY different from Elemental, or Lunar. Holy Magic comes from the Immortals. Those immortals empower the Clerics and Paladins to use their energy. I would think that BECAUSE Holy Magic Comes with restrictions (Devotion[kinda], Soul), that it would be more powerful. Now to go back tot he point of argument, A Paladin, Calling upon the Immortals to cast a <harmful/attack> spell against one of the Immortals very own DEVOUTE followers, You really think theyd be like 'Ya ok go ahead and kill that person, I really didnt' like the way he prayed to me anyhow.'
No, And same goes for Clerics vs Paladins. We SHOULD be held to a higher expectation than some Warrior Mage. That is all for now.
~ Teh Solo Hunta<<<<<<<
I'd suggest if you want spells that do what clerics do you go reroll and become a cleric. Spells are designed for the individual guild in mind right now. Yes Shield of Light would have been a viable paladin spell in a different form but it's a cleric spell now. Will that change? It might become a shared spell, it might not. Clerics have several spells based on manipulation of holy mana into a light source. But I think in the long run based on Skralthaen's work that the holy mana/light source thing is going to be revealed as a manipulation of spirit energy. And spirit is something clerics are going to be the master's of. And right now we're making good headway getting there.
Kali
Why should we share books at all? It sounds like you want access to all the cleric spells that would supplement paladin spells.
>>>>> I DON"T think Res should be a Paladin thing - Though up until 2 minutes ago when I asked a buddy, I was always under the impression Ressurection was an ability, not a spell (since You have to go on the quest for it) Rejuve would be nice, but I don't really see that as a Paladin-thing. I think spells like SoL, Centering, Bless, HE - those are spells I think would be a good thing to share. I don't think a COMPLETE murger of books would be good (All spells in X book), Put in some restrictions.<<<<<
Resurrection was a spell. What it is in the future is anyone's guess. Lets see Centering uses spiritual magic to center me. Paladins have a balance spell already but if I remember correctly it costs soul so having Center means you don't have to use soul for it. Bless. Hmm let's see, paladins over 50th can quest for a holy weapon but it takes time to recharge it and time to get it. Bless means they don't have to do any of that. Harm Evil. Hmm seems like smite and shatter affect undead but take a lot of mana. Harm evil gives them a targetted spell for a tert guild. Hrrm ok let's not even go there. Shield of Light. Let's see paladins get a bonus to learning armor and stances after 10th they get an extra point every ten circles towards stance. Shield of Light creates shields that are lighter and better made then ordinary shields and give a bonus when used against undead. Hmm. Armor primary and a shield of light.
Ok so what we have here is a paladin who can target undead using a shield of light with a self blessed weapon who's balance will come back to solid faster. Hrrm Anyone see any problems with this?
>>>> ... and as far as "Clerics have the highest Shield Req' .. Thats such a lame argument, what the hell? You have to get 51 ranks of shield, omg, thats SOOO hard. Thats no excuse to say 'oh ya we should have SoL because like we have to do 51 in shield'.. Now, the thing about bendin light was a good argument that makes me really think about maybe the spells shouldn't be shared...><<<<<<<<,
Clerics have the highest amount of required ranks compared to any other guild. We have to learn 51 ranks in a tert skill. And when I learned my first 51 ranks was way before shield became viable to train.
>>>>>>> .And now - to the Immune to Holy. Holy Magic is WAY different from Elemental, or Lunar. Holy Magic comes from the Immortals. Those immortals empower the Clerics and Paladins to use their energy. I would think that BECAUSE Holy Magic Comes with restrictions (Devotion[kinda], Soul), that it would be more powerful. Now to go back tot he point of argument, A Paladin, Calling upon the Immortals to cast a <harmful/attack> spell against one of the Immortals very own DEVOUTE followers, You really think theyd be like 'Ya ok go ahead and kill that person, I really didnt' like the way he prayed to me anyhow.'
No, And same goes for Clerics vs Paladins. We SHOULD be held to a higher expectation than some Warrior Mage. That is all for now.
~ Teh Solo Hunta<<<<<<<
I'd suggest if you want spells that do what clerics do you go reroll and become a cleric. Spells are designed for the individual guild in mind right now. Yes Shield of Light would have been a viable paladin spell in a different form but it's a cleric spell now. Will that change? It might become a shared spell, it might not. Clerics have several spells based on manipulation of holy mana into a light source. But I think in the long run based on Skralthaen's work that the holy mana/light source thing is going to be revealed as a manipulation of spirit energy. And spirit is something clerics are going to be the master's of. And right now we're making good headway getting there.
Kali
You are so right Kalira. Who the hell am I to offer Sentinals Resolve, Anti Stun, Courage, Halt, and other Paladin spells to your guild. I now see that you are all a bunch of greedy snivling idiots.
How dare I think that a cleric might be excited about casting Courage, or having a defense against stuns. My bad.
~ Teh Solo Hunta
How dare I think that a cleric might be excited about casting Courage, or having a defense against stuns. My bad.
~ Teh Solo Hunta
Sharing holy magic would be far more benefical to Paladins. You'd have access to a magic prime guild's spells, your current spells, and maintain the abilities of a non-magic prime guild (Forging bonus, minimal hinderance in armor, Lead) et cetera. We have communes, but they're not nearly as good as any of those 3 abilities.
It's not going to happen anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it.
-Statis
It's not going to happen anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it.
-Statis
>>>>>>>You are so right Kalira. Who the hell am I to offer Sentinals Resolve, Anti Stun, Courage, Halt, and other Paladin spells to your guild. I now see that you are all a bunch of greedy snivling idiots.
How dare I think that a cleric might be excited about casting Courage, or having a defense against stuns. My bad.
~ Teh Solo Hunta <<<<<<<
And how do any of those spells fit in with clerical magic or guild design? Greedy idiots? No if we were we'd want all those spells plus ours. But spells are one of the main things that contribute to a guild's uniqueness. Actually I think you and not all paladins are greedy and sniveling. You're the one who wants all the clerical spells that greatly enhance paladin spells.
And having spells in one guild such as courage or bless promotes cooperation between guilds instead of making it possible for one guild to have everything.
How dare I think that a cleric might be excited about casting Courage, or having a defense against stuns. My bad.
~ Teh Solo Hunta <<<<<<<
And how do any of those spells fit in with clerical magic or guild design? Greedy idiots? No if we were we'd want all those spells plus ours. But spells are one of the main things that contribute to a guild's uniqueness. Actually I think you and not all paladins are greedy and sniveling. You're the one who wants all the clerical spells that greatly enhance paladin spells.
And having spells in one guild such as courage or bless promotes cooperation between guilds instead of making it possible for one guild to have everything.
I think I've found the problem
>>And having spells in one guild such as courage or bless promotes cooperation between guilds instead of making it possible for one guild to have everything.
>>~ Teh Solo Hunta
Dark Angel Crusinix
"Conservatives are people who fight to keep what liberals brought to order years ago."
>>And having spells in one guild such as courage or bless promotes cooperation between guilds instead of making it possible for one guild to have everything.
>>~ Teh Solo Hunta
Dark Angel Crusinix
"Conservatives are people who fight to keep what liberals brought to order years ago."
My arguement against sharing spells with the Paladin guild is simple and to the point and has nothing to do with what guild has the rights to what or whatever.
I want to be unique. If I wanted to be a paladin I'd have played a paladin.
The moral of the story is, kids: If you want the spells the other guild has, go join it.
Janyl
I want to be unique. If I wanted to be a paladin I'd have played a paladin.
The moral of the story is, kids: If you want the spells the other guild has, go join it.
Janyl
I think the argument was targetting the older spells...but a completely new book of spells.
Pallies would get version 1
Clerics would get version 2
Two Holy Guilds working together would get version 3 of the spell...
I think its a good way to promote inter-guild cooperation...
we both work for the gods...what's the difference?
-Hansley->>
PS - Its just an idea =p
Pallies would get version 1
Clerics would get version 2
Two Holy Guilds working together would get version 3 of the spell...
I think its a good way to promote inter-guild cooperation...
we both work for the gods...what's the difference?
-Hansley->>
PS - Its just an idea =p
the answer is simple... when the permanent memorizing of scrolls is allowed ... allow us to learn higher tier spells by first permanently obtaining the lower tier.... if in the same mana types... ie cleric/paladin warmage/bard empath/ranger.
moonmages dont have a companion guild... but they have unleash which is a VERY useful spell.
scroll spells are not as effective when cast by other guilds.. even if the same mana type... any cleric who has casted courage knows what i mean.
i dont like random backfires.. it should be skill based
to learn higher tier spells... greater sacrifices might be considered.
no reason a paladin couldnt forego a few of his own guilds spells... sacrifice the tdps and learn through the prereqs SoL
and even be able to use it at the limits of the soft and hard caps... given the skill.
some people fear this will create "canned" magic users, with everyone just learning the best from each guild... but i highly doubt that... there are good spells in every guild, and sacrificing tdps is NOT something to be taken lightly if your looking at long term results with your charicter.
moonmages dont have a companion guild... but they have unleash which is a VERY useful spell.
scroll spells are not as effective when cast by other guilds.. even if the same mana type... any cleric who has casted courage knows what i mean.
i dont like random backfires.. it should be skill based
to learn higher tier spells... greater sacrifices might be considered.
no reason a paladin couldnt forego a few of his own guilds spells... sacrifice the tdps and learn through the prereqs SoL
and even be able to use it at the limits of the soft and hard caps... given the skill.
some people fear this will create "canned" magic users, with everyone just learning the best from each guild... but i highly doubt that... there are good spells in every guild, and sacrificing tdps is NOT something to be taken lightly if your looking at long term results with your charicter.
>>Maybe we could allow paladins to learn cleric spells, at the cost of two spell slots for a first tier, three spell slots for a second tier, etc. Would really make people think twice about it.
Oooor, we can keep things the way they are and keep the guild lines unique. This arguement has been hashed and rehashed to death as it is. At one time, I might have advocated sharing SOL with the Paladins but, I think that being unique and having your OWN spells and abilities is much more important. While I can understand and even see the case some have made for wanting a certain spell I also know that anything can be rationalized.
Oooor, we can keep things the way they are and keep the guild lines unique. This arguement has been hashed and rehashed to death as it is. At one time, I might have advocated sharing SOL with the Paladins but, I think that being unique and having your OWN spells and abilities is much more important. While I can understand and even see the case some have made for wanting a certain spell I also know that anything can be rationalized.
One of the reasons SoL will never be shared with paladins is that it is a conjured item. The magic guru has stated conjuration magic in general is reserved for Magic Primary guilds.
With this in mind I think Paladins should get a spell that is cast on existing shields to lower hinderance and improve durability.
Lagerby
With this in mind I think Paladins should get a spell that is cast on existing shields to lower hinderance and improve durability.
Lagerby
I got really into suggesting shared pallie abilities a while back, but there was hardly any respone to any of my suggestions. I think the GMs were lookin' fer a non-magic ability. A glyph/commune that would work independedntly in either guild's hands, but would be kinda amazing when done together. I personally think it should be a non-magical ability, if it were to exist. Maybe I can come up with some more suggestions.
-Gheist
-Gheist
Gheist- I am with you- commune or spell- a new shared spell/ability with differant effects for each guild, and a third larger effect when combined. I think it would be a fascinating and differant combination than what you normally see in DR.
Just so long as neither guilds solo abilities are watered down or worthless abilities.
Flavius
Just so long as neither guilds solo abilities are watered down or worthless abilities.
Flavius
Good idea on the combined magic for increased efficacy.
Might help give people in both guilds the boost that appears to be sought after while not stepping on the toes of the "don't touch my uber abilities" folks (not sure why but I get the mental image of a kid throwing a temper tantrum everytime I hear that babble.)
I'd also like to ask for some verification on what is meant by "magic prime" in relation to "magic tert". It was my impression that prime/secondary/tertiery were ONLY used in reference to learning rate. But several of the posts in this thread make us of these terms to "prove" why one or the other guild can or cannot have a certain spell or ability. I haven't sifted through hundreds of posts to find an answer in relation to magic but I have certainly seen GM responses confirming this impression in other folders.
Any clarification would be appreciated.
Again - good idea Gheist. It might also be useful to look at this from the standpoint of combining a commune with a glyph (?) - just bringing it up.
Cyllwdd
Might help give people in both guilds the boost that appears to be sought after while not stepping on the toes of the "don't touch my uber abilities" folks (not sure why but I get the mental image of a kid throwing a temper tantrum everytime I hear that babble.)
I'd also like to ask for some verification on what is meant by "magic prime" in relation to "magic tert". It was my impression that prime/secondary/tertiery were ONLY used in reference to learning rate. But several of the posts in this thread make us of these terms to "prove" why one or the other guild can or cannot have a certain spell or ability. I haven't sifted through hundreds of posts to find an answer in relation to magic but I have certainly seen GM responses confirming this impression in other folders.
Any clarification would be appreciated.
Again - good idea Gheist. It might also be useful to look at this from the standpoint of combining a commune with a glyph (?) - just bringing it up.
Cyllwdd
