>Yes, if SoP isn't a prereq, you might not want it...but don't be surprised if Team Magic makes a prereq for a Ranger spell.

If awaken forest is on the agenda still I can see it being a pre req for that so you don't kill yourself using the spell.

Also archers who don't melee alot might find the evasion boost more useful than I do.

Evasions my best skill by a good amount and as such if I can't hunt something it's usually because of something else in my arsenal not being up to speed. Probably why I don't find SOP useful.

The runestone suggestion is an excellent one.

Arrys

I'm on the other end of the spectrum and I find it extremely useful, I never go hunting without it. With SoP up I am hit 1 in 10 spits from vipers, and even then my balaclava blocks it. Without it, I'm hit 4 or 5 in 10. Right there, it makes it useful. I also notice that friends of mine go from parrying every attack, not dodging a single one, to dodging every attack and not even attempting a parry when I cast it on them. Before I hunt anything I throw up a SotT and a SoP and head out, those two spells combined make a wicked combination.

-Teeklin Tessenoak, Proud Ranger of Elanthia


"Lasciate ogni speranza voi ch'entre." -Dante Alighieri

<< funny thing, my parry isn't too far from my evasion and my personaly testing shows that Sop give me more of a boost to evasion then Sott does. I choose sop and not Sott. This is unhindered with 100% evasion and 80% parry.

<< Falk

Hmmm... what race are ya Falk? One with a reflex hinderance? Because SOTT gives me a heck of a better boost.

Tusca

>>Falk>>my personaly testing shows that Sop give me more of a boost to evasion then Sott does

<snicker>

How many times I have to tell you, Falk, samatak is NOT a spell component? SoP protecting better than SotT? I think you need to run those tests again, bud. SoP is nice, but it's not even CLOSE to SotT.

Your problem likely lies in the fact that SoP is a first-tier spell and caps quickly. SotT is much tougher and takes more magic skill to pump up effectively. I can cast SoP capped, but can only put a little over half the full mana into SotT. But even now, SotT provides far better protection of the two. Can't wait to see what sort of protection/duration I get from SotT when I gain the skill necessary to cap the sucker, heh.

The weakness lies with your magic skill, not the spell. SoP won't get much better for you (if at all). SotT has a long way to go as your skills grow. Keep working the magics and be patient.

~~~Krin

<<The weakness lies with your magic skill, not the spell

Krin I have more magic then you, so any power yer getting, I know I'm getting more from sott. :oP

I Tested it in genis.

Just standing with a geni no spell, I parry 95% of the time (solidly balanced for all)

With Sott I would parry about 80% of the time and evade the other 20%

With sop I would parry about 20% of the time and evade 80% of the time

And with both I would evade almost 100% of the time.

I'm an elf with a bonus to reflexes (not sure that really matters).

But this is just my personal test. I would think Sott would give a better bonus being it is a higher tier spell (second tier isn't much higher then first), but for me, I cant see it.

I have 4 slots still open, but am currently statisfed with my spells. If I find my self needing more of a boost, I can still choose Sott. Currently I'm ok. I just thought I'd share.

Falk

<<Falk, I bet Krin cast SOP with an cambrinth item at with as much mana in the spell as it can be cast at. Do you do this?

I can, but sop is pointless to max cast. I can cast it at its max without using my orb, (65 mana) but it gives the same affect as preping 6 times at 5 mana. (13 minute max)

Sott on the other hand cant be max cast using an orb, you will still backfire, unless you have the PM and harness it takes to cast it at it's max. (Neither Krin, nor I are that good, yet)

<<I know my HOL is a lot more effective and gives me a higher bonus when I cast it at 65 mana with the help of a cambrinth orb vs the 35 or so I can do without it.

If you can find a room that has good enough mana to cast it at 65 (which is the cap of HOL), you will see that it has the same effectiveness as if you used an orb.

If you dont have enough PM or harness to cast at the max cast an orb cant help you do you, you will back fire just as if you hadn't used an orb.

Hope that helps.

Falk

PS. To keep with the original post, I would like to see Sop MAX time increased as long as the effectiveness remained intacked.

Well it wouldn't be unbalancing at all if you said for every 5 mana past 35, the duration increased 1 minute. Means you would cap the spell out at what, 65 mana and 19 minutes? Or 60 mana and 18 minutes...don't know the cap on SoP, haven't reached it yet. I don't really think that 19 minutes versus 13 minutes is all that unbalancing considering the massive amount of mana you'd have to pump into it to get 19 minutes of time. As it is now, there's not any point in putting more than like 30 mana into it and getting the full duration, a 65 mana cast is just a waste of 35 mana.

-Teeklin Tessenoak, Proud Ranger of Elanthia


"Lasciate ogni speranza voi ch'entre." -Dante Alighieri

SOP vs SOTT; I ran a test on SOP (posted in scientific rangers). Gonna do the same with SOTT. My thought is that SOP will help with straight evasion. SOTT will help with all around defense (as its targeting reflexes directly). I don't think SOP gives me as much (if any) as a bonus in multi that SOTT does, but that's a whole other test.

Just from some short playing around, one on one, SOP seems to be better, hands down with helping evasion. In multi situations though, SOTT might be better all around.

And SOTT definately has sexier messaging.

~Tanshar

<<Well it wouldn't be unbalancing at all if you said for every 5 mana past 35, the duration increased 1 minute. Means you would cap the spell out at what, 65 mana and 19 minutes? Or 60 mana and 18 minutes...don't know the cap on SoP, haven't reached it yet. I don't really think that 19 minutes versus 13 minutes is all that unbalancing considering the massive amount of mana you'd have to pump into it to get 19 minutes of time. As it is now, there's not any point in putting more than like 30 mana into it and getting the full duration, a 65 mana cast is just a waste of 35 mana.

But wouldn't this be overcome by just stacking it over and over with medium preps until you reach the cap?

-Spiritshadow

SOP seems to give me a straight bonus to evasion, but I am currently soft capped on evas in genis and now just doing them for weapons, MO and parry... SOTT is my spell of choice at that point because I can throw 40 mana in it and it lasts longer than maxed SOP and because it boosts reflex i can dance with 3-4 genis, which will not only train my armor, parry and MO but actually even lock my evasion.

Both good spells. Wish SOP had ANY Barrier effect like ES did.

Piex

I told this to Falk in IM;s but I will say it here too.

You have two cars. One with a amx speed of 80 (SoP) and one with a top speed of 200 (SotT). The former you can get the gas pedal to teh floor, the latter you can barely move the pedal ... for now.

The first car will seem like the faster ... and, for you, it is. But when you are able to get both cars to max speed, you will find the second car to be the better.

Until you can cast both spells at max prep, they cannot be compared. Period. It's useless to compare one's skills against another in a case like this. Until you can cast both spells capped, its pointless. You can't see where they lead.

I'd rather hear Dritz's assessment, he is a LOT closer to capping SotT than any of us is.

~~~Krin

>>Teeklin>>Actually Special K, it's not like that at all. You can use SOP and SotT at the same time. 280mph wins over 200mph every time.

Agreed. I was addressing the "either/or" debate. ;-)

~~~Krin

I know you're taking a break and have other things on your plate, but...

Could you please give us a status report on the empath spell, Guardian Spirit? I know its a big one most of us are dying to see.

Or maybe at least a few teasers?

Oh, and can I make mine do tricks like a familiar?

Ok, done.

Shaunn