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This has probably been said before, but I want to add my voice to the faceless multitude. I'll start off by saying I hate origami. I have several reasons, but you don't need to hear them for purposes of this statement. I have broken down and started folding paper as the primary method of learning mech lore. It's the only reasonable method of learning it at an advanced skill and pace. But it's too expensive. I bought myself envelopes totalling 350 sheets, and I went to Veii's website so I could maximize the efficiency at which I learned. I folded 350 sheets and learned approximately 3.5 ranks of mech lore. I, like others who have gone this route, want to learn my 600 ranks of mech lore, and I feel I am as deserving as anyone else who has walked down that same road. However, as I only have about 250 ranks currently, that means I'll have to purchase and fold another 35,000 sheets of paper, which will cost me around 1000 plats!!! I haven't made that much money in my entire career and I won't be likely to have made that much if and when I hit circle 150. I am a straight-up player who doesn't cheat and I don't feel I should be penalized for that. When I mention cheating, that means I don't have a second account with a trader scripting money for my primary character; and I don't buy plats off the internet. I earn my money the old-fashioned way. Please consider lowering the price of origami, as I don't want to feel taken advantage of by other players who are not as scrupulous.
Q.
Hmmm, let's see here. Aside from giving the typical 'if it costs too much, then don't do it' comment, I will look at some of the things you mentioned.
<<It's the only reasonable method of learning it at an advanced skill and pace.
There are other methods to learn mech lore, but I will agree with the advanced skill and pace comment.
<<I folded 350 sheets and learned approximately 3.5 ranks of mech lore.
This would end up 100 sheets for each rank of mech lore. At 1.25 plat an envelope, seems like a fair price to me. However, plats are not difficult to come by anymore, especially hunting up in Rossmans. In fact, I believe I see you up in Rossmans frequently.
<<as I only have about 250 ranks currently, that means I'll have to purchase and fold another 35,000 sheets of paper, which will cost me around 1000 plats!!!
Knowing that origami scales up in difficulty, it is reasonable to assume the pace you are at now should remain mostly constant. In other words, if you are spending 1.25 plat per rank now, you should continue to do so. To go from 250 to 600 ranks, using the pace you have, would result in you spending 437.5 plat. True, that is a lot of paper and folding, but I wonder how many swings of my scimitar it will take to go from 250 to 600. Now, I am in no way trying to compare weapon learning to mech lore, just looking at the repetitive nature of the examples.
<<I haven't made that much money in my entire career and I won't be likely to have made that much if and when I hit circle 150.
I do not assume to know how you train or hunt. But you are a paladin, correct? I am pretty confident you will have more than 1000 plat in the bank by the time you hit 150 (let alone the thousands of plat you will make and spend on your way there)
<<I am a straight-up player who doesn't cheat and I don't feel I should be penalized for that. When I mention cheating, that means I don't have a second account with a trader scripting money for my primary character; and I don't buy plats off the internet. I earn my money the old-fashioned way.
Nor I. I just hit 100th and have about 4000 plat in the bank. I would say I have made well more than 5 times that, all while earning the money the old-fashioned way as you put it.
Ok, now that I have that out of the way. I read your post as a rant. The points I brought up above shows this. Is origami expensive? I suppose so if you are a young character hunting goblins through swamp trolls. Yes, 1.25 plat per rank is extremely high for those characters. But not for those people who hunt up in Rossmans (or fendryads for that matter). In fact, I pick up 10 ranks of mech lore per circle (which means I am spending 12.5 plat on envelopes) and have absolutely no trouble padding my bank accounts while doing so.
So, the only valid point you bring up is that for younger characters, origami can be very expensive. But then again, all of these characters do not have 250 ranks in mech lore. As I stated at the beginning, there are other viable ways to train mech lore and are excellent substitutions for the younger characters.
Trebber
<<It's the only reasonable method of learning it at an advanced skill and pace.
There are other methods to learn mech lore, but I will agree with the advanced skill and pace comment.
<<I folded 350 sheets and learned approximately 3.5 ranks of mech lore.
This would end up 100 sheets for each rank of mech lore. At 1.25 plat an envelope, seems like a fair price to me. However, plats are not difficult to come by anymore, especially hunting up in Rossmans. In fact, I believe I see you up in Rossmans frequently.
<<as I only have about 250 ranks currently, that means I'll have to purchase and fold another 35,000 sheets of paper, which will cost me around 1000 plats!!!
Knowing that origami scales up in difficulty, it is reasonable to assume the pace you are at now should remain mostly constant. In other words, if you are spending 1.25 plat per rank now, you should continue to do so. To go from 250 to 600 ranks, using the pace you have, would result in you spending 437.5 plat. True, that is a lot of paper and folding, but I wonder how many swings of my scimitar it will take to go from 250 to 600. Now, I am in no way trying to compare weapon learning to mech lore, just looking at the repetitive nature of the examples.
<<I haven't made that much money in my entire career and I won't be likely to have made that much if and when I hit circle 150.
I do not assume to know how you train or hunt. But you are a paladin, correct? I am pretty confident you will have more than 1000 plat in the bank by the time you hit 150 (let alone the thousands of plat you will make and spend on your way there)
<<I am a straight-up player who doesn't cheat and I don't feel I should be penalized for that. When I mention cheating, that means I don't have a second account with a trader scripting money for my primary character; and I don't buy plats off the internet. I earn my money the old-fashioned way.
Nor I. I just hit 100th and have about 4000 plat in the bank. I would say I have made well more than 5 times that, all while earning the money the old-fashioned way as you put it.
Ok, now that I have that out of the way. I read your post as a rant. The points I brought up above shows this. Is origami expensive? I suppose so if you are a young character hunting goblins through swamp trolls. Yes, 1.25 plat per rank is extremely high for those characters. But not for those people who hunt up in Rossmans (or fendryads for that matter). In fact, I pick up 10 ranks of mech lore per circle (which means I am spending 12.5 plat on envelopes) and have absolutely no trouble padding my bank accounts while doing so.
So, the only valid point you bring up is that for younger characters, origami can be very expensive. But then again, all of these characters do not have 250 ranks in mech lore. As I stated at the beginning, there are other viable ways to train mech lore and are excellent substitutions for the younger characters.
Trebber
Trebber, as I recall, 1 envelope of 100 sheets in Leth cost me 3.7 plats, and that does add up to 1000 plats. I haven't made 4000 plats in my career, in fact, I haven't made 1000. Maybe 500. I don't much hunt critters with boxes, but focus on skinning. Yes, I hunt in Rossman's, and I get about 300 lirums per peccary bristle, of which I skin maybe 1 in 5 peccaries. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where I'm going here. I'm sure I could have made more money in my time, but I also don't buy up good deals at the fests to wring money from those who didn't at a later time. I believe I have hunted reasonably during my career, and made an average amount of money for a paladin of my circle. Every point I made was and still is valid. The only reason I can see for anyone posting against it would be to maintain a current monopoly on a skill set. That, or our guilds differ so much in hunting, and therefore income, that you cannot possibly see where I am coming from. My gripe stands. Origami is way too expensive...unfairly so.
Q.
Q.
<<Trebber, as I recall, 1 envelope of 100 sheets in Leth cost me 3.7 plats
Stop paying 3 times as much as you need to. The envelopes of 100 sheets of plain paper costs 1.25 plat. And I seriously label myself as having a monopoly on the skill set. Please don't project your frustrations on me. There are smarter ways of going about what you want to do.
<<but I also don't buy up good deals at the fests to wring money from those who didn't at a later time.
Nor do I. I was referring to earning coin by hunting. Let's agree on two things. We don't know that much about each other. And you are spending way too much on origami than you should be spending. Your ranks could care less if the paper is blue or plain.
Trebber
Stop paying 3 times as much as you need to. The envelopes of 100 sheets of plain paper costs 1.25 plat. And I seriously label myself as having a monopoly on the skill set. Please don't project your frustrations on me. There are smarter ways of going about what you want to do.
<<but I also don't buy up good deals at the fests to wring money from those who didn't at a later time.
Nor do I. I was referring to earning coin by hunting. Let's agree on two things. We don't know that much about each other. And you are spending way too much on origami than you should be spending. Your ranks could care less if the paper is blue or plain.
Trebber
Paper should be a creation system. It seems like a no-brainer to me.
- Buy some paper pulp, a press and some scissors or something. Learn a little mech from making it. Not as much as you would using it, but keep it in line with other creation systems.
- You can add dyes from berries etc if you want. Good little mech boost.
- At a higher skill (200 mech or so) you can begin makeing paper that is a little more delicate and difficult to work with (paper made from different woods; yew, ironwood, bloodwood, mistwood whatever). It would teach a good bit of mech making it and it would make the paper a much more potent learning device
- Sell it to the young folk or those that don't feel like making it themselves for cheaper!
I agree it should be less expensive. However as it stands now, my empath earns enough to use exclusively origami without assistance from my other characters. Almost all of my money from shifting goes into origami though.
~Purehand
- Buy some paper pulp, a press and some scissors or something. Learn a little mech from making it. Not as much as you would using it, but keep it in line with other creation systems.
- You can add dyes from berries etc if you want. Good little mech boost.
- At a higher skill (200 mech or so) you can begin makeing paper that is a little more delicate and difficult to work with (paper made from different woods; yew, ironwood, bloodwood, mistwood whatever). It would teach a good bit of mech making it and it would make the paper a much more potent learning device
- Sell it to the young folk or those that don't feel like making it themselves for cheaper!
I agree it should be less expensive. However as it stands now, my empath earns enough to use exclusively origami without assistance from my other characters. Almost all of my money from shifting goes into origami though.
~Purehand
THANK YOU!!! There are less costly envelopes on the table! Thats what I wanted to hear. Look, when a person posts a complaint, they are hoping someone in charge will read it and pass on the complaint. Don't get mad at me if I come back at you for playing the part of the peanut gallery. Advice is wonderful, and I appreciate good advice as much as anyone. Arguing against my post only tells me someone has a motive for not wanting what I have requested. I apologize for any offense taken, but please understand where I'm coming from. Less expensive paper is what I needed to hear from the players. Thank you for telling me. Im on my way down there right now to get some more.
Q.
Q.
Just wait until you cant learn mech from the current origami system and try using it for only scholarship. I go through 5 to 10 envelopes a day now...I don't even wana add up how much that is costing me per rank. Of course if you want a cheeper but still effective method of learning mech embroidering taught me pretty well to about 300 lessons.
Madas Prosperious
Madas Prosperious
<<THANK YOU!!! There are less costly envelopes on the table! Thats what I wanted to hear. Look, when a person posts a complaint, they are hoping someone in charge will read it and pass on the complaint. Don't get mad at me if I come back at you for playing the part of the peanut gallery. Advice is wonderful, and I appreciate good advice as much as anyone. Arguing against my post only tells me someone has a motive for not wanting what I have requested. I apologize for any offense taken, but please understand where I'm coming from. Less expensive paper is what I needed to hear from the players. Thank you for telling me. Im on my way down there right now to get some more.
could have summed all that up in one word.
DOH!
~Bre
"Have you ever felt like the world was a tuxedo, and you were a pair of brown shoes?"
could have summed all that up in one word.
DOH!
~Bre
"Have you ever felt like the world was a tuxedo, and you were a pair of brown shoes?"
