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Hello there, folks.
I was wondering how many folks have been using the Boat notification slates? Is this something that is being used by a lot of you guys? Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit? What part of the Citizenship system do you like the best? The least? Where would you like to see it progress towards?
Some more things are in the works, but I'd rather be working on things that you guys want to see, rather then things that I think you guys want to see.
Post your thoughts here, but please keep things civil and constructive.
Thanks,
BrewMaster Paklin
Boat notification boards are okay, just a pain in the neck sometimes as their reach seems to be severly limited.
Not paying to use ferries,lifts are good, most helpful in some cases.
Not sure if you guys can expand the titles some so not gonna get into that.
Last I knew only Mer'ris or whatever (sorry, its been a long nite) had the symbols iding you as a citizen,them badges or whatever. Any way to get them expanded for the other areas?
Ratha, Zol, etc?
Maybe a special merchant that sells citizen items?? Sorry, starting to run dry here as its not really indicated what benefits we get from being a cit.
A tired trader
Not paying to use ferries,lifts are good, most helpful in some cases.
Not sure if you guys can expand the titles some so not gonna get into that.
Last I knew only Mer'ris or whatever (sorry, its been a long nite) had the symbols iding you as a citizen,them badges or whatever. Any way to get them expanded for the other areas?
Ratha, Zol, etc?
Maybe a special merchant that sells citizen items?? Sorry, starting to run dry here as its not really indicated what benefits we get from being a cit.
A tired trader
I use the boards, but would like them expanded. I can pay my debt anywhere on the islands. As a citizen of M'riss I would like to use the boards anywhere on the islands. Can we get auto disembark and board set up on the boards and ships? If I have my name on the board, and the ship arrives, I should get on it automatically. And a board could be added to the ship with the different locationa and we could automatically disembark at the stop we signed up for.
It would be truely wonderful if this worked if we were in game or now.
Magdar
It would be truely wonderful if this worked if we were in game or now.
Magdar
Greetings Paklin.
>Where would you like to see it progress towards?
Well, I first have to say that I'm not a citizen of any Province as it is yet, but I might have some ideas.
1. Give us the possibility to add the name of a city instead of a Province. Like some said, Muspar'i is different than Therengia, and Crossing is different than Arthe Dale.
2. During invasions, have the Guards grab and drag the dead bodies of the citizens of that province to the nearest Cleric Guild, along with what they dropped when dying. We are the ones paying their wages, they could drag our corpses, isn't it?
3. Give unique items to each province via a shop. Items include fluff items (like badges, jewelry with the Province sign) and useful items (like weapons from a given place, or armors, or magical items).
4. Reduced fees for crimes committed in our Province. I mean, we might have been buddies with the judge in the past, can't we?
5. Reduced horses fees in our Province (for those using the stables and horses).
6. Increase the value of sold items in our Province (gem pouches, bundles, etc...). After all, we are contributing to the business of our Province, so we should get an extra for it.
7. Special messaging from Guild leaders from our Province when circling, with a special suggestion maybe (like a training advice about what to hunt, what spell to get, etc...). I was thinking about a bonus in TDP's or something, but that might be too much to ask for. grins
8. An increased possibility to have the Guards look at the other side when stealing (after all, they know us from a long time, so it's not like they are suspecting us, right? grins).
I hope this helps.
Fafrahd the slinger
PS: About crime aspects of my suggestions (stealing, etc...), just to clarify things, I'm not stealing from people. But I thought these suggestions were appropriate.
>Where would you like to see it progress towards?
Well, I first have to say that I'm not a citizen of any Province as it is yet, but I might have some ideas.
1. Give us the possibility to add the name of a city instead of a Province. Like some said, Muspar'i is different than Therengia, and Crossing is different than Arthe Dale.
2. During invasions, have the Guards grab and drag the dead bodies of the citizens of that province to the nearest Cleric Guild, along with what they dropped when dying. We are the ones paying their wages, they could drag our corpses, isn't it?
3. Give unique items to each province via a shop. Items include fluff items (like badges, jewelry with the Province sign) and useful items (like weapons from a given place, or armors, or magical items).
4. Reduced fees for crimes committed in our Province. I mean, we might have been buddies with the judge in the past, can't we?
5. Reduced horses fees in our Province (for those using the stables and horses).
6. Increase the value of sold items in our Province (gem pouches, bundles, etc...). After all, we are contributing to the business of our Province, so we should get an extra for it.
7. Special messaging from Guild leaders from our Province when circling, with a special suggestion maybe (like a training advice about what to hunt, what spell to get, etc...). I was thinking about a bonus in TDP's or something, but that might be too much to ask for. grins
8. An increased possibility to have the Guards look at the other side when stealing (after all, they know us from a long time, so it's not like they are suspecting us, right? grins).
I hope this helps.
Fafrahd the slinger
PS: About crime aspects of my suggestions (stealing, etc...), just to clarify things, I'm not stealing from people. But I thought these suggestions were appropriate.
Decrease the taxes to a reasonable amount that more people could afford or make the taxes based on circle or something. If it's an across the board decrease, how about 1 gold per month? If it's circle based maybe make it 1 gold for 1st to 20th circle, 2 gold for 21st to 30th and so on. Currently my char can't afford citizenship but would join up if the cost was lower.
>Decrease the taxes to a reasonable amount that more people could afford or make the taxes based on circle or something. If it's an across the board decrease, how about 1 gold per month? If it's circle based maybe make it 1 gold for 1st to 20th circle, 2 gold for 21st to 30th and so on. Currently my char can't afford citizenship but would join up if the cost was lower.
I think taxes should be 1 plat a month per circle, of the coin of the province. If you can't afford 3 gold a month in taxes, perhaps you should reconsider the value of citizenship.
This will keep the poor uncivilized horde out of our snobbish clubs.
~Kodiac
Post meant in jest. Though I don't see a reason to lower taxes. And flat taxes are good. ::Democrats take heed...::
I think taxes should be 1 plat a month per circle, of the coin of the province. If you can't afford 3 gold a month in taxes, perhaps you should reconsider the value of citizenship.
This will keep the poor uncivilized horde out of our snobbish clubs.
~Kodiac
Post meant in jest. Though I don't see a reason to lower taxes. And flat taxes are good. ::Democrats take heed...::
The boards are nice... but I've never used one.
On Aesry, the board placement doesn't work with the topography. If you're in town you have to go all the way to the dock to sign up. Once you're there, there really isn't any point to go all the way back so it makes the board a little useless.
Maybe if there was a sign up board in town as well so we could get notified then make the trek out to the dock.
Plus more Aesry benefits would be nice since the slate is the only one we have right now
On Aesry, the board placement doesn't work with the topography. If you're in town you have to go all the way to the dock to sign up. Once you're there, there really isn't any point to go all the way back so it makes the board a little useless.
Maybe if there was a sign up board in town as well so we could get notified then make the trek out to the dock.
Plus more Aesry benefits would be nice since the slate is the only one we have right now
First let me state that I am a Theren citizen.
I haven't used the boat notification system, but I definitely would if barges were included (sand barges too).
The parts I like the best are the citizen only shops (which we don't have yet in Theren), and the discounts at stores/banks/etc.
The part I like the least is there being a library in Theren that has been excluded from non-citizens...to me, libraries should always be available to everyone. But that is my personal view.
Things I would like to see.
Expanded titles. It would be nice to know if a Therengian Citizen was from Riverhaven or Langenfirth or Therenborough or somewhere else. The same goes for all the provinces.
More citizen only shops. As far as I know (I may be wrong), only Shard has this available, and they only have one.
Auto board and disembark (if we are signed up and standing next to the boat when it arrives). I would think this is codeable as there is already auto-disembark for the lifts on Ratha.
More reduced fees. This could include stabling for horses or caravans, crime fees, NPC empaths, etc. Doesn't have to be only bank fees.
Foreign embassy offices in each province, with the ability to pay your debts while traveling. This is especially important for travelling clerics and paladins, who cannot tithe if they are in debt anywhere.
More citizen-only gathering areas. Telomin Hall in Theren is nice...but it could be improved upon. More food and drink, perhaps a wandering kitten or puppy,
Can't think of anymore right now, but if...I mean when (grins)...I think of anything else, I will be posting again.
~me~
I haven't used the boat notification system, but I definitely would if barges were included (sand barges too).
The parts I like the best are the citizen only shops (which we don't have yet in Theren), and the discounts at stores/banks/etc.
The part I like the least is there being a library in Theren that has been excluded from non-citizens...to me, libraries should always be available to everyone. But that is my personal view.
Things I would like to see.
Expanded titles. It would be nice to know if a Therengian Citizen was from Riverhaven or Langenfirth or Therenborough or somewhere else. The same goes for all the provinces.
More citizen only shops. As far as I know (I may be wrong), only Shard has this available, and they only have one.
Auto board and disembark (if we are signed up and standing next to the boat when it arrives). I would think this is codeable as there is already auto-disembark for the lifts on Ratha.
More reduced fees. This could include stabling for horses or caravans, crime fees, NPC empaths, etc. Doesn't have to be only bank fees.
Foreign embassy offices in each province, with the ability to pay your debts while traveling. This is especially important for travelling clerics and paladins, who cannot tithe if they are in debt anywhere.
More citizen-only gathering areas. Telomin Hall in Theren is nice...but it could be improved upon. More food and drink, perhaps a wandering kitten or puppy,
Can't think of anymore right now, but if...I mean when (grins)...I think of anything else, I will be posting again.
~me~
>Decrease the taxes to a reasonable amount that more people could afford or make the taxes based on circle or something. If it's an across the board decrease, how about 1 gold per month? If it's circle based maybe make it 1 gold for 1st to 20th circle, 2 gold for 21st to 30th and so on. Currently my char can't afford citizenship but would join up if the cost was lower.
Why should circle have anything to do with citizenship taxes? We get the same benefits regardless of circle, shouldn't we pay the same?
Apu
Why should circle have anything to do with citizenship taxes? We get the same benefits regardless of circle, shouldn't we pay the same?
Apu
<<I was wondering how many folks have been using the Boat notification slates?
I've used it a few times, but usually before it comes time for me to get the message, I've already wiped my name off and jumped on the boat (When I'm waiting for the Lybadel, I tend not to stray too far from the docks).
<<Is this something that is being used by a lot of you guys? Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit? What part of the Citizenship system do you like the best? The least? Where would you like to see it progress towards?
I'd like to see time-based benefits similiar to those that premmies have (but not the same) in that the longer you've been a citizen, the more benefits you get. For example, after being a citizen for something, say 2 in game years or 1/2 or 1 IRL year (hard to gauge it since taxes are based on every IRL month if I'm not mistaken), your taxes drop by 10%. Or so. On Aesry, a special tunnel or catapault system for quicker travel from town and the docks. Maybe have some merchants only accessable by citizens... there are merchants that have race, guild, and/or premmie restrictions, I don't see why citizenship can't be the same for some merchants.
The only thing I don't really like about it right now is paying so much for it for so few benefits (at the moment at least). Being a citizen and living on Aesry, I don't really ride on the boats very often and I can't remember the last time I needed to go shopping. I'm paying more each month for citizenship than I am for my vault. I'm not complaining in that I'm struggling to make ends meet as far as my in game bank account, it's just a lot to be paying for not getting much in return right now. I'm choosing to remain a citizen for the time being because I'm gambling that something time-based will pop up one day ;)
-Spiritshadow
I've used it a few times, but usually before it comes time for me to get the message, I've already wiped my name off and jumped on the boat (When I'm waiting for the Lybadel, I tend not to stray too far from the docks).
<<Is this something that is being used by a lot of you guys? Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit? What part of the Citizenship system do you like the best? The least? Where would you like to see it progress towards?
I'd like to see time-based benefits similiar to those that premmies have (but not the same) in that the longer you've been a citizen, the more benefits you get. For example, after being a citizen for something, say 2 in game years or 1/2 or 1 IRL year (hard to gauge it since taxes are based on every IRL month if I'm not mistaken), your taxes drop by 10%. Or so. On Aesry, a special tunnel or catapault system for quicker travel from town and the docks. Maybe have some merchants only accessable by citizens... there are merchants that have race, guild, and/or premmie restrictions, I don't see why citizenship can't be the same for some merchants.
The only thing I don't really like about it right now is paying so much for it for so few benefits (at the moment at least). Being a citizen and living on Aesry, I don't really ride on the boats very often and I can't remember the last time I needed to go shopping. I'm paying more each month for citizenship than I am for my vault. I'm not complaining in that I'm struggling to make ends meet as far as my in game bank account, it's just a lot to be paying for not getting much in return right now. I'm choosing to remain a citizen for the time being because I'm gambling that something time-based will pop up one day ;)
-Spiritshadow
Greetings Apu.
>Why should circle have anything to do with citizenship taxes? We get the same benefits regardless of circle, shouldn't we pay the same?
Well, I guess you weren't making as much money when you were 5th circle than right now, right? grins
So basically, even if the service is the same, you can imagine to pay more for it, because you're earning more. I know Social Security works that way in France. All workers are healed the same, but if you earn more, you pay more for it (I'm not including extra personal insurances and such that one might need since Social Security isn't paying for everything).
This way, the "rich" can help pay for the "poor". This is some kind of redistribution system.
Just my 2 cents.
The player behind Fafrahd the slinger
>Why should circle have anything to do with citizenship taxes? We get the same benefits regardless of circle, shouldn't we pay the same?
Well, I guess you weren't making as much money when you were 5th circle than right now, right? grins
So basically, even if the service is the same, you can imagine to pay more for it, because you're earning more. I know Social Security works that way in France. All workers are healed the same, but if you earn more, you pay more for it (I'm not including extra personal insurances and such that one might need since Social Security isn't paying for everything).
This way, the "rich" can help pay for the "poor". This is some kind of redistribution system.
Just my 2 cents.
The player behind Fafrahd the slinger
Greetings Pablin.
I just had more idea...
What about putting a teleportation center in every city of every Province. The way it would work would be with moongates allowing citizen of that Province to travel by moongates directly to any other town of the Province.
So for Zoluren, when in Crossing, you would have a room with moongates to Leth Deriel, to Arthe Dale and to Dirge.
This would only allow easy travel within the Province (nothing inter-provincial there) and could come up with a small fee for each travel.
Fafrahd the slinger
I just had more idea...
What about putting a teleportation center in every city of every Province. The way it would work would be with moongates allowing citizen of that Province to travel by moongates directly to any other town of the Province.
So for Zoluren, when in Crossing, you would have a room with moongates to Leth Deriel, to Arthe Dale and to Dirge.
This would only allow easy travel within the Province (nothing inter-provincial there) and could come up with a small fee for each travel.
Fafrahd the slinger
>So basically, even if the service is the same, you can imagine to pay more for it, because you're earning more. I know Social Security works that way in France. All workers are healed the same, but if you earn more, you pay more for it (I'm not including extra personal insurances and such that one might need since Social Security isn't paying for everything).
Those who earn bring in more taxable income in France and the rest of the world tend to get better protection from police, fire, and other public services. I would renounce my Ilithi citizenship if I had to pay more taxes and did not get any extra or better benefits.
Those who earn bring in more taxable income in France and the rest of the world tend to get better protection from police, fire, and other public services. I would renounce my Ilithi citizenship if I had to pay more taxes and did not get any extra or better benefits.
Why don't the province GMs have town council meetings with the citizens of their particular province occasionally? Could take place in one of the citizen-only areas and both general province issues and citizenship issues could be discussed.
Or just have an NPC representative handle citizenship or other IC issues. Would allow citizens to have greater input in the further development of the province with regards to things such as improved travel, housing locations, types of shops that should be "encouraged" to set up in the area. Basically, think of what a mayor or town council IRL does and see what you can apply to DR.
Like a few others here mentioned, I'd definitely also like to see the ability to specify a particular city within a province. Or at least get Throne City citizenship ;p. Would be nice if being a citizen of a particular city offered more benefits tailored to the atmosphere of that particular city also.
Or, if that's not an option, just that the benefits in a particular city for citizens of that province suit the atmosphere of the city. For instance, you could put shops in Theren that sell armors emblazoned with the emblem of the Therengian guard. Or a merchant in Throne that sells robes with the seal of Throne City. Entire fashion styles could be developed for different provinces to set them apart.
Or maybe code it in so the NPCs would recognize and greet citizens differently. Or maybe NPC empaths handle citizens before non-citizens (although I'm stabbing myself in the foot here since 85% of the time I go to NPCs for healing and I have no citizenship on any character).
Maybe a thief could get better/faster contacts in his/her home province/city.
I'd say war mages get the same with their familiar, or rangers with tracking and/or foraging, but I'd first have to know whether or not citizenship implies that the character him/herself has a greater knowledge of the "lay of the land".
Ahh, another idea based on those who have problems paying the cost... Maybe some sort of credit system based on killing creatures considered a menace to the province? Like Shard probably doesn't like all those Adan'f and rock trolls milling around outside their south gate, so if you've killed X number your taxes go down Y amount. If it can't be done "behind the scenes" in coding, then you could set it up so commonly dropped objects could be traded in somewhere for credit.
Or just have an NPC representative handle citizenship or other IC issues. Would allow citizens to have greater input in the further development of the province with regards to things such as improved travel, housing locations, types of shops that should be "encouraged" to set up in the area. Basically, think of what a mayor or town council IRL does and see what you can apply to DR.
Like a few others here mentioned, I'd definitely also like to see the ability to specify a particular city within a province. Or at least get Throne City citizenship ;p. Would be nice if being a citizen of a particular city offered more benefits tailored to the atmosphere of that particular city also.
Or, if that's not an option, just that the benefits in a particular city for citizens of that province suit the atmosphere of the city. For instance, you could put shops in Theren that sell armors emblazoned with the emblem of the Therengian guard. Or a merchant in Throne that sells robes with the seal of Throne City. Entire fashion styles could be developed for different provinces to set them apart.
Or maybe code it in so the NPCs would recognize and greet citizens differently. Or maybe NPC empaths handle citizens before non-citizens (although I'm stabbing myself in the foot here since 85% of the time I go to NPCs for healing and I have no citizenship on any character).
Maybe a thief could get better/faster contacts in his/her home province/city.
I'd say war mages get the same with their familiar, or rangers with tracking and/or foraging, but I'd first have to know whether or not citizenship implies that the character him/herself has a greater knowledge of the "lay of the land".
Ahh, another idea based on those who have problems paying the cost... Maybe some sort of credit system based on killing creatures considered a menace to the province? Like Shard probably doesn't like all those Adan'f and rock trolls milling around outside their south gate, so if you've killed X number your taxes go down Y amount. If it can't be done "behind the scenes" in coding, then you could set it up so commonly dropped objects could be traded in somewhere for credit.
I also wish that we could pay our taxes in any province. Right now I have a character with debt in Ilithi, and she's way up in Therengia. Would be nice to be able to pay it off up there.
Maybe a town-crier sort of system for approaching barges and ferries, letting us know they will be docking soon as well.
I'd like to also see improved citizen shops. The one in Theren is nice and all, but...well, one only needs so many hats.
No matter what, my character is proud of her Therengia citizenship, and happy with whatever benefits come from that.
Annee, player of many
Maybe a town-crier sort of system for approaching barges and ferries, letting us know they will be docking soon as well.
I'd like to also see improved citizen shops. The one in Theren is nice and all, but...well, one only needs so many hats.
No matter what, my character is proud of her Therengia citizenship, and happy with whatever benefits come from that.
Annee, player of many
>>Why should circle have anything to do with citizenship taxes? We get the same benefits regardless of circle, shouldn't we pay the same?
Same reason as in RL.. You make more... More ability to pay means more revenue which means more services for the poor, a happier populace and less chance of revolution...
Same reason as in RL.. You make more... More ability to pay means more revenue which means more services for the poor, a happier populace and less chance of revolution...
>Same reason as in RL.. You make more...
Then I want more. I want to live in the rich white people neighborhood with strong police presence, better empaths, better schools, and the ability to influence the local government. Until then I will continue to lie about my circle to the taxman.
Then I want more. I want to live in the rich white people neighborhood with strong police presence, better empaths, better schools, and the ability to influence the local government. Until then I will continue to lie about my circle to the taxman.
>>I was wondering how many folks have been using the Boat notification slates?
No ships in Ilithi, and they won't let me use the other ones ::pouts::
>>Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit?
Yep :)
>>What part of the Citizenship system do you like the best?
Running my friends heads into the gates of Shard at night <g>
>>The least?
Not being able to pay my taxes from other provinces, especially overseas.
>>Where would you like to see it progress towards?
Citizenship for commoners ::pokes::
~Kyrrian
No ships in Ilithi, and they won't let me use the other ones ::pouts::
>>Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit?
Yep :)
>>What part of the Citizenship system do you like the best?
Running my friends heads into the gates of Shard at night <g>
>>The least?
Not being able to pay my taxes from other provinces, especially overseas.
>>Where would you like to see it progress towards?
Citizenship for commoners ::pokes::
~Kyrrian
>>Do you wish to see more of this type of benefit?
Not only would I like to see more OF it, I would like to see more definition FOR it.
My specific quandry is ... to whom does the Captain of the Lybadel (or any other ship, but this one I will use for example) show allegiance?
I can understand that the yardsmen who operate the piers would be employed by the province to alert citizens of that same province when ships arrive at the piers, regardless of the ship's allegiance. But wouldn't the ship's crew also possibly show an interest in alerting citizens of their own province of their arrival as well?
The government of the province to which the ship holds allegiance would merely establish an agreement for such services and the Captain would carry with them (from the home province's coffers) payment for each stop to pay for the service, using the runners which already do the chore anyway.
So when the Lybadel stops in Aesry, not only are Ri'shalians (sp?) alerted, but also ... Therengians? If the Lybadel flies a Therengian flag (I am not sure WHAT flag they fly, but makes sense) then we get alerted too.
Wouldn't even mind if my province asked for a meager (say, 200 lirum) recompense for this service, if I chose to use it, before boarding. Especially if they just added it to my debt which I could easily take care of while in Riverhaven.
Sound good?
And while we're on that tack ... how about setting up a provincial clerk (there's a medieval-style term for treasurer, but I forget it now) on board the ship, who is able to take care of debts for any Province they dock at, but do so only for debts in a Province where you are a citizen. Pay your coin to the clerk, they make a payment in your name next time the ship docks (with a Moon Mage assistant who Thoughtcasts a message back to the debt office of that province for immediate recording, of course).
So, continuing with the Lybadel example, a Ri'Shalian or Therengian could pay debts in their home province on the Lybadel though doing so while IN your home province seems redundant, unless the ship is closer than the Debt Office is.
Possible?
~~~Krin
Not only would I like to see more OF it, I would like to see more definition FOR it.
My specific quandry is ... to whom does the Captain of the Lybadel (or any other ship, but this one I will use for example) show allegiance?
I can understand that the yardsmen who operate the piers would be employed by the province to alert citizens of that same province when ships arrive at the piers, regardless of the ship's allegiance. But wouldn't the ship's crew also possibly show an interest in alerting citizens of their own province of their arrival as well?
The government of the province to which the ship holds allegiance would merely establish an agreement for such services and the Captain would carry with them (from the home province's coffers) payment for each stop to pay for the service, using the runners which already do the chore anyway.
So when the Lybadel stops in Aesry, not only are Ri'shalians (sp?) alerted, but also ... Therengians? If the Lybadel flies a Therengian flag (I am not sure WHAT flag they fly, but makes sense) then we get alerted too.
Wouldn't even mind if my province asked for a meager (say, 200 lirum) recompense for this service, if I chose to use it, before boarding. Especially if they just added it to my debt which I could easily take care of while in Riverhaven.
Sound good?
And while we're on that tack ... how about setting up a provincial clerk (there's a medieval-style term for treasurer, but I forget it now) on board the ship, who is able to take care of debts for any Province they dock at, but do so only for debts in a Province where you are a citizen. Pay your coin to the clerk, they make a payment in your name next time the ship docks (with a Moon Mage assistant who Thoughtcasts a message back to the debt office of that province for immediate recording, of course).
So, continuing with the Lybadel example, a Ri'Shalian or Therengian could pay debts in their home province on the Lybadel though doing so while IN your home province seems redundant, unless the ship is closer than the Debt Office is.
Possible?
~~~Krin
