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I dunno about you guys but why do our meditations have to have cons ? I mean I know mages who can throw SW on themselves and have equivlant defenses of 50 ranks higher, so they run into Lang troll's when they supposed to be in marauders and what not, sure they take there lumps, but defensive spells and offensive spells shouldent be signifcantly more powerful than our Meditations. As to the next complain "Well we have to put mana into our spells blah blah blah" I dont see mages having to spend 20 mins waiting for full fire to come back, granted theres exceptions among us, the exceptions being people with 40+ discipline, but a 20th circle wm can cast swift winds and parry things they otherwise would have no chance to block or evade, the same goes for rangers stw spell. Basically what Im saying is that our meditations should be just as effective as spells.
~Kerken
Because historically our gurus have not had either the will or the political sway to give us abilities without penalties. Rather, the trend of late has been to give us new and interesting penalties that no other guild in the game has, like strength of ability affected by title, or the new, groundbreaking notion that increasing a stat decreases an ability.
So I think we've been conditioned to ask for things with penalties, because we're pretty darned sure we're not going to get abilities without downsides. I guess the idea is if we come up with our own penalties, they might not be as arbitrary as the ones handed down from on high.
The truly damaging thing, in my opinion, is that others see us as skill-rich, so we should not get more abilities, even though most of our abilities can't be used simultaneously, as other guilds can use theirs. Perhaps it's this vision that makes our gurus down-tweak our abilities, just to get them approved.
Gruesome
__________
"You're just going to have to figure out what it wants. What is its motivation?"
"It's a rock monster. It doesn't have motivation."
"See, that's your problem, Jason. You were never serious about the craft."
So I think we've been conditioned to ask for things with penalties, because we're pretty darned sure we're not going to get abilities without downsides. I guess the idea is if we come up with our own penalties, they might not be as arbitrary as the ones handed down from on high.
The truly damaging thing, in my opinion, is that others see us as skill-rich, so we should not get more abilities, even though most of our abilities can't be used simultaneously, as other guilds can use theirs. Perhaps it's this vision that makes our gurus down-tweak our abilities, just to get them approved.
Gruesome
__________
"You're just going to have to figure out what it wants. What is its motivation?"
"It's a rock monster. It doesn't have motivation."
"See, that's your problem, Jason. You were never serious about the craft."
Don't forget the ever popular idea coming -- retreat = hit to IF -- cause we all know THAT makes it a lot more fun :/
God...
I'm with Kerken, please.. abilities without new creative drawbacks :(
---
Barbarism is needed every four or five hundred years to bring the world back to life. Otherwise it would die of civilization. ~Edmond and Jules de Goncourt, Journal, 3 September 1855
God...
I'm with Kerken, please.. abilities without new creative drawbacks :(
---
Barbarism is needed every four or five hundred years to bring the world back to life. Otherwise it would die of civilization. ~Edmond and Jules de Goncourt, Journal, 3 September 1855
Hell the only way I can handle massive swarms with this new combat system is "\xretreat\r adv\r atta" with the combination of balance not mattering and defensive hits for making offensive moves.
We still need people on Team Barb who have us as their number one priority.
starkad
___
Now I walked on ice and never fell
I spend my time in a plush hotel
I stood on many stages, held many mics
Take airplane flights, at huge heights
So all you sucker MC's, you gotta say please
Cause when he jumps high, I'm pulling down weeds
We still need people on Team Barb who have us as their number one priority.
starkad
___
Now I walked on ice and never fell
I spend my time in a plush hotel
I stood on many stages, held many mics
Take airplane flights, at huge heights
So all you sucker MC's, you gotta say please
Cause when he jumps high, I'm pulling down weeds
>>Don't forget the ever popular idea coming -- retreat = hit to IF -- cause we all know THAT makes it a lot more fun :/
RETREAT won't give an IF hit. Flee will, but there will be another way to flee that won't give a hit. You rush through them. Basically putting your weight behind you.
We are barbs people. Time we start acting like it. Yes there are drawbacks to our abilities, and can't stack a lot of our stuff. Guess that's cause we don't need the crutch to survive like some of these others do.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
RETREAT won't give an IF hit. Flee will, but there will be another way to flee that won't give a hit. You rush through them. Basically putting your weight behind you.
We are barbs people. Time we start acting like it. Yes there are drawbacks to our abilities, and can't stack a lot of our stuff. Guess that's cause we don't need the crutch to survive like some of these others do.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
>>I'm with Kerken, please.. abilities without new creative drawbacks
Oops hit post too soon. I do agree on this though. So quit suggesting drawbacks and just post uber ideas everyone. Every idea I post I don't post a drawback, as there is no reason to have one.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
Oops hit post too soon. I do agree on this though. So quit suggesting drawbacks and just post uber ideas everyone. Every idea I post I don't post a drawback, as there is no reason to have one.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
I'm curious how the notion that retreating will douse the inner fire hits those of us that have gone the ranged route?
I'm sure someone around here is bow-prime. They've got to have an opinion on the matter. I'm assuming they just haven't bothered to voice a "this sucks" feeling.
Hopefully this retreat penalty will only happen during a berserk.
~Kodiac
Shield: It does a body good.
I'm sure someone around here is bow-prime. They've got to have an opinion on the matter. I'm assuming they just haven't bothered to voice a "this sucks" feeling.
Hopefully this retreat penalty will only happen during a berserk.
~Kodiac
Shield: It does a body good.
Drawbacks are what define this guild! Don't start neutering the drawbacks, too!
And since we're talking drawbacks... could we please start getting some more severe roundtime drawbacks, please? I'm thinking some ability that can only be initiated at melee while kneeling in a multi-opponent learning situation... maybe requiring multiple bleeders or just a missing right arm... Something like berserk but not... Maybe barbs could get a cool ability like 'spontaneous combustion'or...
>Beloric is ownzed and forceably removed from this thread before your very eyes.
"Ezzoo abah baday deloo abeh ledoo de dada do de lehdeedop badee da deh la dadida babadah behdelee bedayda ladaday le bahbay babaday badedalideh la dee"
-- Leon Redbone
And since we're talking drawbacks... could we please start getting some more severe roundtime drawbacks, please? I'm thinking some ability that can only be initiated at melee while kneeling in a multi-opponent learning situation... maybe requiring multiple bleeders or just a missing right arm... Something like berserk but not... Maybe barbs could get a cool ability like 'spontaneous combustion'or...
>Beloric is ownzed and forceably removed from this thread before your very eyes.
"Ezzoo abah baday deloo abeh ledoo de dada do de lehdeedop badee da deh la dadida babadah behdelee bedayda ladaday le bahbay babaday badedalideh la dee"
-- Leon Redbone
>We are barbs people. Time we start acting like it. Yes there are drawbacks to our abilities, and can't stack a lot of our stuff. Guess that's cause we don't need the crutch to survive like some of these others do.
Would you be cool with someone stealing every cent of your disposable income because you don't need it to survive? Ever turn down a raise because you're making enough money to survive and don't need any more?
It's not about needing a crutch to survive. It's about wanting to have some cool things. And cool things don't have to come with a bunch of caviats and downsides.
Our subscription price is the same as other guilds, and our population is large enough to justify as much good development as others get. I think we're justified in desiring equal value.
Gruesome
__________
"You're just going to have to figure out what it wants. What is its motivation?"
"It's a rock monster. It doesn't have motivation."
"See, that's your problem, Jason. You were never serious about the craft."
Would you be cool with someone stealing every cent of your disposable income because you don't need it to survive? Ever turn down a raise because you're making enough money to survive and don't need any more?
It's not about needing a crutch to survive. It's about wanting to have some cool things. And cool things don't have to come with a bunch of caviats and downsides.
Our subscription price is the same as other guilds, and our population is large enough to justify as much good development as others get. I think we're justified in desiring equal value.
Gruesome
__________
"You're just going to have to figure out what it wants. What is its motivation?"
"It's a rock monster. It doesn't have motivation."
"See, that's your problem, Jason. You were never serious about the craft."
>>Hopefully this retreat penalty will only happen during a berserk.
As I said before, it is not retreat that will cause the hit. It was mentioned at the barb meeting and was the new non-implemented FLEE verb that will cause the inner fire hit.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
As I said before, it is not retreat that will cause the hit. It was mentioned at the barb meeting and was the new non-implemented FLEE verb that will cause the inner fire hit.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
I doubt we'll get much from charge if anything. However, they are evidently planning an alternate form of FLEE for Barbarians where we'll attempt to break through the enemy by simply lowering a shoulder and plowing forward that will not hurt our IF and if I remember correctly may give us an IF boost. Think it's just neutral though.
As far as drawbacks go, meditatioins who's primary funtion is to enhance other things should NOT cause IF drain. For instance, whatever mediation we're getting that will include warpaint Im assuming will give us a charisma boost. This should have no IF drain because we're already going to loose fire from using our roars. Besides, I think it was said they would mostly rely on concentration, which so far is pretty much an untapped area of power for us, especially those who keep up on their discipline.
If we do have drawbacks it would be nice if we could make them non-combat oriented, heh. Like a long-lasting berserk-esque type thing that we use while hunting makes us look real scary and murderer looking so that town guards might not let us in for a while after, or something like that.
______________________________________
~Meis
Madness is coming your way. ~K.K.
If we do have drawbacks it would be nice if we could make them non-combat oriented, heh. Like a long-lasting berserk-esque type thing that we use while hunting makes us look real scary and murderer looking so that town guards might not let us in for a while after, or something like that.
______________________________________
~Meis
Madness is coming your way. ~K.K.
>>This should have no IF drain because we're already going to loose fire from using our roars.
You loose fire from your roars? I sure don't. It gives voice damage, which takes time to recover, but does not affect fire in the least with the exception of one roar (Bloodthirst).
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
You loose fire from your roars? I sure don't. It gives voice damage, which takes time to recover, but does not affect fire in the least with the exception of one roar (Bloodthirst).
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
Drawbacks, IMO, are more appealing to the GM audience as they show an attempt at achieving balance. You can't have the super strength and stamina from a berserk (as it stands now) without getting worn out at the end of it (and if you can, I'm impressed by your stamina).
Game balance seems to be a key issue in developing new abilities/skills. At least, it has been in my observation of the abilities released since I've been playing.
Yeah, it'd sure be nice to have an ability without a drawback, but I don't think it's a realistic dream to hold on to.
Maulem~
>
Droughtman says, "Your blockers for today are Grishnok, Sorrow, Velmix and Teiro."
Game balance seems to be a key issue in developing new abilities/skills. At least, it has been in my observation of the abilities released since I've been playing.
Yeah, it'd sure be nice to have an ability without a drawback, but I don't think it's a realistic dream to hold on to.
Maulem~
>
Droughtman says, "Your blockers for today are Grishnok, Sorrow, Velmix and Teiro."
>>For what it's worth, my roars are quite useful at level.
Concurs totally. Just a couple weeks ago before I decided to do some more backtraining on weapons I immobolized 4 caracals with wail. Definately usable at level.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
Concurs totally. Just a couple weeks ago before I decided to do some more backtraining on weapons I immobolized 4 caracals with wail. Definately usable at level.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
Just wondering... How many of you actually think that if we're in a desperate situation enough that we actually have to flee, and we try to lower our shoulder and plow through the enemy to get away, that we'll be able to? Berserk is gonna get screwed to the point where we can't retreat at all, and can't even see the room exits in some cases, so there goes our other alternative.
I just can't see being stunned, nearly tipping over, overwhelmed by 4 critters and then deciding, "Damn, guess it's time to charge right over the top of'em!". Yes, we're barbarians, but we're not idiots.
As for charging in general, why can't we charge from missile to pole when using pole-ranged weapons?
-Aya
"If you are flammable and have legs, you can never be blocking a fire exit" - Mitch Hedberg.
>You pull Nasmyth to his feet, but he just falls back over since he is dead.
I just can't see being stunned, nearly tipping over, overwhelmed by 4 critters and then deciding, "Damn, guess it's time to charge right over the top of'em!". Yes, we're barbarians, but we're not idiots.
As for charging in general, why can't we charge from missile to pole when using pole-ranged weapons?
-Aya
"If you are flammable and have legs, you can never be blocking a fire exit" - Mitch Hedberg.
>You pull Nasmyth to his feet, but he just falls back over since he is dead.
Gotta note that Bear has damn good charisma for his circle.
However, Im soon to follow his path... Im sick of losing Will vs Will spell contests while dancin dragon.
Charisma is my new friend <3
---
Barbarism is needed every four or five hundred years to bring the world back to life. Otherwise it would die of civilization. ~Edmond and Jules de Goncourt, Journal, 3 September 1855
However, Im soon to follow his path... Im sick of losing Will vs Will spell contests while dancin dragon.
Charisma is my new friend <3
---
Barbarism is needed every four or five hundred years to bring the world back to life. Otherwise it would die of civilization. ~Edmond and Jules de Goncourt, Journal, 3 September 1855
My charisma is atrocious for my circle. Yet I still find my roars incredibly useful hunting bristle back pork chops. Anger the earth, rage, fury...they are all quite effective and useful with 3 sometimes 4 piggies. and have saved my arse numerous times.
And bear a charmer? He couldn't charm the pants off a stripper.
;P
Player behind Soleran
"I'm Rick James!"
And bear a charmer? He couldn't charm the pants off a stripper.
;P
Player behind Soleran
"I'm Rick James!"
I have wail and madness, I have a slot for another one but not too sure what I want. I heard anger earth got tweaked down alot, and I heard the one that makes critters drop their weapons isn't too effective cause they just can pick them back up right away. Hmm, not even sure what I want really. haha. What do others feel are pretty successful/helpful roars?
Codiax.
Codiax.
>>I have wail and madness, I have a slot for another one but not too sure what I want. I heard anger earth got tweaked down alot, and I heard the one that makes critters drop their weapons isn't too effective cause they just can pick them back up right away. Hmm, not even sure what I want really. haha. What do others feel are pretty successful/helpful roars?
The main two I use are wail and shriek. I use justice at times. Shriek decent but you'd have to get the prereq roar to get that one, which I don't use very much at all.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
The main two I use are wail and shriek. I use justice at times. Shriek decent but you'd have to get the prereq roar to get that one, which I don't use very much at all.
Brabs
Fighting with a bunch of archers in Geni.
"Hey, it's shoot GENI, not shoot GEN!"
Ambassador Genneron, of M'riss
[Arcath] "Public Service Announcement: Please shoot at the archers and not at Arcath"
I use Rage, Embrace and Anger for hunting which all seem very easy to pull off and work really well together. I can usually effect up to 4 critters at level with position/balance
If I am training defenses I use embrace/anger and if I am working weapons use rage/anger. Not big on the wow factor, but very effective for hunting. Anger is not what it used to be but still helpful.
If I am training defenses I use embrace/anger and if I am working weapons use rage/anger. Not big on the wow factor, but very effective for hunting. Anger is not what it used to be but still helpful.
