A bit late to this conversation but I'll add my few thoughts:

>The true nature of Empathy is still the subject of scholarly debate in game, and it's a bit confusing and contradictory even to those who are familiar with it.

I think there's two major disconnects that have are the most difficult things to get across when my character has had discussions on this topic.

- "Empathy" (Transference) as the attunement to life itself - My character sees this as a natural scientific attunement that allows for the recreation and sensory perception of living matter and energy in it's deepest form.

vs

- Life magic as the attunement to the >"streams of magic"< (important difference) involved in the recreation and refinement of life essences

and

- "Empathy" the skill.. vs "Empathy" the personal trait.

I actually thought transference was a more appropriate title for this skill, although I suppose Empathy had a bit more flair to it and it's right up the alley of this guild's lore to find a more "puffy" name for its core skill.

> Empathy and Necromancy are antithetical, though they do draw from the same well, so it seems like you'd have a matter/antimatter sort of situation if you tried to combine the two in one vessel.

I've always seen that this way as well. Necromancers are attuned to the essences and reformation of death and Empaths on the side of the living. They are the ying/yang of the universe in regards to life and death. The Moon Mages appear to come in at the point where they are bending the world in ways it was not meant to be bent through the streams of magic which is something I really have no knowledge to go into in depth.

>Would Empaths put hits on Empaths who delve into Necromancy?

I can confirm (this is public knowledge for some anyway) that the Empath guild has put out hits on Empaths who delve too deeply into Empathy. Asrea had a chance first hand to witness the unabridged stance of the Guild's true views on things. What they are doing could reasonably be best for everyone, she believes it's the best for no one, and as always the truth lies in the unknown grey zone.

>Empathy doesn't make people nice.

Confirmed. Being mean is more fun really because people don't expect it.

>>Ok, so, I suppose the next question is why do the powers that be really dislike Empathy/Thanatology going to completion?

The history books seem to show that either going to completion is very, very bad.

>They hate competition?

My character believes this is true and has good reason to do so.

>Strangely, and perhaps intentionally, there's very little empathic (true to the German Einfühlung, "feeling your way into") about some of the practitioners of Empathy. Jomay is, as was pointed out, the classic example.

Jomay is a very interesting case. She was a classic villain for quite a while for me until my character started to feel some resistance to sharing personal experience particularly in the case of involvement with the Lyras ritual and her theories on the ritual itself and it's lack of revelation afterwards. After taking up a stance against the Guild which in some ways simply did what needed to be done and in other ways threw her in front of a train, she received a fair amount of negative PR from the guild. It raised the question.. how would she be described in a library book? After countless years of persecution and being on the run.. wouldn't you be a little bitter? Is Jomay's condition of her own doing or does the Empath guild have a deeper involvement in the creation of this villain? When Asrea realized she was the one being portrayed as crazy it was far less unrealistic to her that Jomay (at one point) was a victim and not a criminal.

>
I'm not sure how I'd rank Empaths on a shadiness scale, among all the guilds, but they're definitely in the top three.

I would be really interested in learning more about the Guild's underlying political connections because there's a lot to be dug up there. With all their fear of mob justice against the Empathy guild.. it's interesting how supportive they are of a certain group that loves just that.

>Empaths get away with it because they have enough of a PR department going on that most people, public and guildmembers, just have no idea there's anything to even question.

It's some thick armor. We've seen a few cracks though :)

>It kills me to see Empaths these days who actively encourage other people to harm themselves so that they can get some Empathy exp

I don't like this both OOC/IC, but I can understand that policing it is near impossible. Smarter minds than mine would have came up with a mechanic to stop it if it was possible I'm sure.

>Also, as someone who became an Empath (and chose it as a main) in part for all the shadowy politicking and for the potential fun of challenging the norms and expectations of what it means to be an Empath

It's a lot of fun.. don't be afraid to jump in the deep end of the pool :)

>>>that treasured place Empaths have (or used to have) in society.

Ahh that treasured place... my palace built of small clear topaz. Just kidding! I understand what you mean of Empaths formerly being protected in a sense but I think this only led to no one wanting to have an Empath as anything but a mule character unfortunately.

I really like the new healing changes, guild direction, and Melete (and all the other GM's) you are doing a great job. Thanks!

<<I find it fun how well the guild's "smear campaign" and desire to brush the events of Lyris' death under the rug have worked. To the point where most players don't even know what happened, much less their characters.>>

No one ever knew what happened, and the "end" was designed that way intentionally. What role did the necromancers play (what was that goo anyway? Empath? Moon mages (what was it they were seeing happen to reality anyway)?

If any player tells you they know the truth behind all that, I'm inclined to skepticism. I bet there's only a handful of GMs that know the "truth" behind the end there.

BTW, this thread is awesome; it's the main reason why I read the board--some very cool lore-wonk nerd discussion.