Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:20 PM CDT
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I'm new to role-playing and I wanted to implement something into a character of mine, but I'm unsure how to do so. I see all the typical character types. Most are strong, sturdy adventurers, but what about those less fortunate? What if my character is disabled or just lacks the brawn of others. Could I still make this character function in a profession that includes items like heavy armor. Let's say I wanted to be a Paladin, for example, how would I play off weakness while wearing plate and wielding a sword and heavy shield? Is it possible to put in flaws such as this and still have a functioning character?
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:30 PM CDT
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Things like this can be a little tricky. I tried to play a bard who couldn't sing once. It was fun for a while but made things very difficult.

Outside of using ACT to limp around, I don't know what you might do.

If your character were really that weak perhaps you might be interested in toying with a leather-wearing, LE-wielding Paladin?


-Golgol
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:35 PM CDT
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I think its possible. If you use subtle things like a sigh or wince everytime you put on your armour and taking it off every time you're not going to need it, it should come across well. Depending on other personality traits, you should try to avoid introducing it into every conversation or it very quickly gets old. Unless you wan't to rp a weakling that likes to whine about it, of course. ;)

The only catch I can see is since the strength and stamina stats are pretty much essential to gameplay, your character mechanically won't be a weakling. There will also be some verbs which may run counter-productive to your image so figure out which ones those are. It just means that sometimes the game will force you to appear strong, but as long as you can live with that it should be workable.

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:42 PM CDT
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Sure.

You could have a metal weakness - some people stutter, he could just... not be that bright. He could get tongue tied. He could be shy. Countless ideas.

You could also have a physical weakness - however generally these are harder to play. First of all if you keep them as actual wounds they tend to actually hinder game play quite a bit, and then some empath will heal it without asking (or just when healing everything else) and then you have to come up with why it's still there... etc.

As such if you wanted to RP with like say... a limp, you'd likely have to hand wave a reason an empath couldn't heal it and mostly just portray it through your actions and emotes.

You could also get shifted to show yourself as kinda of ugly, or small, or overweight etc.

You could also role play it through weapon choice.

Your paladin just isn't that strong? Maybe he uses chain instead of plate, and sticks to more light weight weapons instead of the more popular giant swords and whatnot. Maybe he relies more on a crossbow for ranged then something that takes more strength to use.




Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:46 PM CDT
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At least currently strength and stamina once you hit enough of a threshold to get rid of your burden and swing at min RT... tend to be less important stats in the long run.

I mean Mozzik (Yes yes... eloth MM shaddup) is nearly 100th and only has 20 str and 30 stam and the only time I regret it is when I swim.



Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 10:47 PM CDT
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<<The only catch I can see is since the strength and stamina stats are pretty much essential to gameplay, your character mechanically won't be a weakling. There will also be some verbs which may run counter-productive to your image so figure out which ones those are. It just means that sometimes the game will force you to appear strong, but as long as you can live with that it should be workable.

Evran hit on the big thing here. This game is quite punishing and unforgiving of unbalanced stats. While you can roll play this direction (and I encourage it! Character weaknesses are great fun), I wouldn't suggest letting your stats back it up.

- George, Player of Foresee
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:00 PM CDT
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<<I mean Mozzik (Yes yes... eloth MM shaddup) is nearly 100th and only has 20 str and 30 stam and the only time I regret it is when I swim.

Oh dear gods, yes. Gnome with 20STR, 26STA and I still have troubles swimming the faldesu at 150 swimming. :/

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:00 PM CDT
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Eh, your stats can back it up to a point.

On one hand it's sort of silly to play a character with 99 strength that acts like they can't even pick up a piece of paper without breaking a sweat.

On the other, hamstringing any stat now is pretty disastrous for playability, and is just generally not a very good thing to do to yourself mechanically.

My compromise for this is making my character's weak points relatively low in her stat spread. My Elf is sort of petite and not very brawny, so strength and stamina are her lowest stats at 30 each.

And as Evran points out, you can pepper your actions with indications that you get tired and whatnot pretty easily. Just don't overdo it. A pant, a WIPE FOREHEAD now and then... answer if someone pries, but keep it subtle and consistent.

I personally measure the talent of a roleplayer by how many believable flaws they give their characters versus their virtues. A character with good, well-thought out and executed flaws is not only infinitely more interesting, they're usually more fun to RP with. Mary Sues (characters that are portrayed as being perfect or good at everything with few or no flaws) are annoying, depthless, and uninteresting. Conflict (not just the PvP kind, mind) is the spice of roleplay and flaws really bring that out.



Rev. Reene

"...[gods] are symbols in a way that no human being, however 'archetypal', can ever be. They are actors playing parts that are real only for us; they are the masks behind which we see our own faces."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:03 PM CDT
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I can ignore mechanics, they're not influencing my "character" per se, they're just they're for the gameplay aspect. If players can't see them, then it shouldn't detract from anything. I thought about trying to run a warrior mage that wears leather armor. Focusing more on spell casting than physical combat.

In terms of Paladin, why does Plate armor not hinder them? Is it training, or do the gods grant me strength? Would it be feasible to play out some strength through armor attribute? I may be weak alone, but when donning my armor I am strong, sort of a He-man thing?
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:33 PM CDT
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They're the best with armor just due to training. There's nothing supernatural about it.

That said... I could easily see a character who was confident and sure in armor, and outside of it felt weak and vulnerable. Just don't over do it.

Also 167 swimming. I can reliably do the Faldesu but the RT is horrible and it takes me like twice as long to lock swimming in there as it should. :(




Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:57 PM CDT
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My Empath walks with a limp. Instead of powering through rooms, I lean on a cane in each room before moving on. I'm not really sure what to do about combat, luckily it's not too hard to avoid as an Empath. I'm not sure how the lore of healing works, and I've never actually talked to anyone about it in game. If anyone asks, right now I'm going with Empaths can't change birth defects short of possibly shifting from an increadibly powerful Empath.


Elemental Lord Opieus, Expert Warrior Mage of Elanthia
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/25/2009 11:58 PM CDT
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>> If anyone asks, right now I'm going with Empaths can't change birth defects short of possibly shifting from an increadibly powerful Empath.

Bruwster pursued Shift because he was born with a clubfoot. He no longer has it.

"Very powerful" seems to fit the bill, at least, depending on the nature of the defect.



Rev. Reene

"...[gods] are symbols in a way that no human being, however 'archetypal', can ever be. They are actors playing parts that are real only for us; they are the masks behind which we see our own faces."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 10:09 AM CDT
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I used to know a character that chronically had a cold. He sniffled and sneezed a lot, and kept a hanky where he could reach it in a hurry. I myself play a couple of characters that are mutes. They have ranger slates to facilitate communication.


Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy

A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 10:32 AM CDT
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Needing glasses is relatively easy to pull off. Glasses have some nice verbs as well.

Lots of people play up a like or dislike for certain foods or drinks.

I've seen some interesting phobias played out in game.


--There are nights when the wolves are silent and only the moon howls.--George Carlin
--'Must you fall asleep when I am talking?'..'No, its purely voluntary'..Churchill
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:30 PM CDT
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Don't know how this goes for weaknesses, but I rp Tish as flat chested with an ever growing hiney and a love of raspberry truffles. Hence that hiney. It's fun, it gets a laugh, and sometimes free truffles. :D


Dragon Luller Tishra Rothem
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:41 PM CDT
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>>Don't know how this goes for weaknesses, but I rp Tish as flat chested with an ever growing hiney and a love of raspberry truffles. Hence that hiney. It's fun, it gets a laugh, and sometimes free truffles. :D

What? I don't think this is the time or the place to talk about female body parts. How crude and unmannered.


- Korsik Rippentropp, Most Noble Paladine

Crusader against the Innocent
Defender of All That is Wrong in Elanthia
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:42 PM CDT
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How does one rp flat chested exactly? Is it like a handicap or...?


~Arwinia

http://www.llbbl.com/data/RPG-motivational/target262.html
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:45 PM CDT
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<<Don't know how this goes for weaknesses, but I rp Tish as flat chested with an ever growing hiney and a love of raspberry truffles. Hence that hiney. It's fun, it gets a laugh, and sometimes free truffles. :D>>

I guess you don't understand the genetics of female gaming avatars. Please refer to Dead or Alive Extreme Beach Volleyball asap.

btw- I think you meant to post this in the Looking for Relationships section

-Mr. Glemm
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:46 PM CDT
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<<How does one rp flat chested exactly? Is it like a handicap or...?>>

They refrain from using bodice verbs.

-Mr. Glemm
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:58 PM CDT
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> How does one rp flat chested exactly? Is it like a handicap or...?

Well if you're a big chested woman like I am when you're done eating you glance down and you're like "darn there sure are a lot of crumbs on my boobs" but if you're flat chested you just look down sadly and maybe wipe a tear from your eye.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 03:58 PM CDT
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>>btw- I think you meant to post this in the Looking for Relationships section<<

LOL


- Terra
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Re: Role-Playing weakness ::Nudge:: on 08/26/2009 04:13 PM CDT
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Ok folks.. I got nothing.

Let's get back to the original poster's questions and less on anatomy of text characters.

Thanks!


Annwyl
Senior Board Monitor

If you've questions or comments, take it to e-mail by writing Senior Board Monitor DR-Annwyl@play.net, or Message Board Supervisor DR-Cecco@play.net.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 05:45 PM CDT
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I agree with Sebastienne. :D


Dragon Luller Tishra Rothem
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 06:03 PM CDT
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In addition to some of the other ideas mentioned (a limp, a wheeze and some of the other physical actions you can perform), perhaps you could enlist the help of a few Empaths who frequent various populated areas.

You could explain your roleplay to them OOCly, and when you bump into them and are socializing, mention "the old pain" or the "bum leg" or what have you. They could provide some "pain management" but remind you that the injury is not something they can heal, pat you on the back sympathetically and send you on your way. You'll find that most people like those sort of roleplay "quirks" in characters, and eventually people will ask how you're feeling when they run into you without any prompting on your part.

There are a million different ways the exchanges could take place, but having some healers about who are familiar with your "situation" would provide valid reasons for it to be brought up without acting like an attention hungry cripple.




~ Vien De'Lionne

"Ridicule may lawfully be employed where reason has no hope of success."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 06:19 PM CDT
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<<You could explain your roleplay to them OOCly, and when you bump into them and are socializing, mention "the old pain" or the "bum leg" or what have you. They could provide some "pain management" but remind you that the injury is not something they can heal, pat you on the back sympathetically and send you on your way. You'll find that most people like those sort of roleplay "quirks" in characters, and eventually people will ask how you're feeling when they run into you without any prompting on your part.>>

I love it when I need to explain my RP in an OOC matter so that people know how to react.


-Mr. Glemm
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 06:36 PM CDT
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Your commentary would be more biting if the mechanics supported what he's getting at.

As I said, empaths make RPing physical limitations... tricky.



Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 06:47 PM CDT
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My comment doesn't need to be "biting". Your comment about whispering to people OOC so they understand what you're trying to do as a character defeats the whole purpose of role-playing.

It's one thing to bring complicated matters like events and such OOC so people can all be on the same page. This is another entirely.

It's not like he can't use Act. Big deal, there's parenthesis. If he's the least bit creative he can pull it off without having to clue people in.


-Mr. Glemm
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 07:15 PM CDT
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>>Your comment about whispering to people OOC so they understand what you're trying to do as a character defeats the whole purpose of role-playing.

That wasn't my comment.

>>It's one thing to bring complicated matters like events and such OOC so people can all be on the same page. This is another entirely.

The suggestion was to use OOC methods to plant the seeds of his RP to help introduce it. It wasn't to walk up to everyone he meets and go OOC Hey, I walk with a limp and have chronic back pain. Play along?

>>It's not like he can't use Act. Big deal, there's parenthesis. If he's the least bit creative he can pull it off without having to clue people in.

Sure, you can use act just fine. The whole point though is that you can have trouble getting everyone on the same page with physical limitations can be difficult due to mechanics.

I was just pointing out that OOC information to help set up an RP is perfectly valid due to mechanic limitations. It's not a replacement for RP, but it can help get everyone on the same page.



Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 08:29 PM CDT
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Wait, wait, wait. You're responding to two different posters.

<<My comment doesn't need to be "biting"...

LORD-RAHL's.

<<Your comment about whispering to people OOC so they understand what you're trying to do...

Mine.

<<defeats the whole purpose of role-playing.

No. Start walking around DR ACTing an injury and tell me how long it takes before some Empath goes "HEY GUY I DONT KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT BUT YOU DON'T HAVE ANY INJURIES". Not every player of an Empath is going to pick up on the fact that they need to treat this person as though they have a permanent injury outside of the healing mechanics.

All it would take is a little "OOC I'm RPing a guy with <insert chronic condition here> that can't be healed by Empaths". I'm not talking about holding some kind of press conference.





~ Vien De'Lionne

"Ridicule may lawfully be employed where reason has no hope of success."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 09:28 PM CDT
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<<Glemm: My comment doesn't need to be "biting". Your comment about whispering to people OOC so they understand what you're trying to do as a character defeats the whole purpose of role-playing.

I see Mozzik and the OP have already responded, but I will forge ahead anyway since I'm in a mood.

If you're in the game to role-play solely for your own benefit to the exclusion of everyone else, then yah, sure your purpose is probably defeated by someone intruding on your bubble with some OOC explanation. I get that, and try to respect that.

There is an alternative viewpoint that considers role-playing a more cooperative effort, which happens to coincide with much of what I think about role-play in DR. I think more OOC communication regarding intent and purpose between players is good. In my opinion, erring on the side of more communication is better than the endless petty misunderstandings that go on over and over among players.

No, I do not always enjoy every player whispering their entire real and imagined back story to me, but I don't mind most, and I can ignore what is irrelevant. I put up with that, and even encourage that, because I would rather be clear on what the other person is thinking, expecting, and emoting.

For the purpose of emulating human interaction we are hugely constrained by the text interface, by game mechanics, and a finite set of canned commands lacking in countless visual and aural cues. I respect any honest attempt to convey a sense of emotion and nuance beyond GRIN, LAUGH, and FROWN, and that includes facile use of obscure verbs, ACT, SAY /emote, or OOC whispers blatantly spelling things out to me.

<< It's one thing to bring complicated matters like events and such OOC so people can all be on the same page. This is another entirely.

I disagree with your dichotomy. They are entirely gradients of the same "thing".

<< It's not like he can't use Act. Big deal, there's parenthesis. If he's the least bit creative he can pull it off without having to clue people in.

Bleh.
As I mention above, I do not agree that clueing people in is bad. From what I've seen not clueing people in does more harm than good.

I am certain I feel this way largely because I am one of the people that frequently gets it "wrong", but if all but the five or six virtuoso players that always get it "right" were booted off the game, I can't imagine anything but a stale and colorless scenario evolving. Every single character I interact with increases the interest of the game for me, whether they are perfectly fleshed out or two-dimensional stereotypes, or Joe Dirt trying to see how big he can get his two-hand edge numbers.

I am not suggesting a role-playing free-for-all. I believe we all benefit when we all do our constructive best to improve the game environment and maintain a level of immersion. Sometimes people really do need to be told "hey, there is a better way".

Sometimes however, focusing exclusively on how things should be really really detracts from having fun with how things are .

I've drifted away from responding to you directly Glemm, and more into rambling out loud. Sorry. Trying to hard again.

~Brian/Bahb
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 09:56 PM CDT
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<<how does one rp flat-chested>>

hey, you could always roll a female s'kra.


The undead hordes would like to take this moment to remind you that they are quite happy to eat your brains so that you may test new depart.Please consider it.Hugs and kisses, Team Necro.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 09:57 PM CDT
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That's a little bit of game lore I think a lot of people miss.

Frequently.




Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 10:10 PM CDT
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>Well if you're a big chested woman like I am when you're done eating you glance down and you're like "darn there sure are a lot of crumbs on my boobs" but if you're flat chested you just look down sadly and maybe wipe a tear from your eye.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:03 PM CDT
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On ACT and OOC whispers:

Show don't tell.

This applies to a lot of different aspects of RP.



Rev. Reene

"...[gods] are symbols in a way that no human being, however 'archetypal', can ever be. They are actors playing parts that are real only for us; they are the masks behind which we see our own faces."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:18 PM CDT
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>>Empaths healing stuff

Well, there have to be some limitations to what Empaths can do. Otherwise no one would die.

You might RP that being healed makes the old wound better for a while, but only temporarily improves it, etc.

The goddess Peri'el (actually a warrior goddess) was badly injured in the fight against the World Dragon, and she could not heal the wounds. So there's a precedent in the lore, I'd think. Unless there's some weird "gods cannot heal themselves" clause that I don't know about.

--Player of Szrael --

Professional Healers Association Fee Calcs: http://empathunion.com (G3 script and web calc links in the sidebar.)

PHA Crossing Healing spot: east, north, go backdoor from Empath guild. (Try gwething if no one is there!)
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:26 PM CDT
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<<Empaths healing stuff

This is reminiscent of a discussion on death and immortality that was had a few weeks back. Mechanics !> Lore.

<<The goddess Peri'el (actually a warrior goddess) was badly injured in the fight against the World Dragon, and she could not heal the wounds. So there's a precedent in the lore, I'd think. Unless there's some weird "gods cannot heal themselves" clause that I don't know about.

There's also the extremist sect of wacky G'nar Pethians who gouge out their eyes, never to see again. There's definitely lore out there to suppport the idea of unhealable wounds. Just because there's a game mechanic in place that allows players to have all their wounds healed, it doesn't preclude lore that says that its possible for a wound to not be healed.

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:28 PM CDT
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>> There's also the extremist sect of wacky G'nar Pethians who gouge out their eyes, never to see again.

Nothing about their lore implies the wounds are unhealable.

Some wounds are, as evidenced by various NPCs with seemingly permanent scars, but we have no idea what causes this.



Rev. Reene

"...[gods] are symbols in a way that no human being, however 'archetypal', can ever be. They are actors playing parts that are real only for us; they are the masks behind which we see our own faces."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:35 PM CDT
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<<Nothing about their lore implies the wounds are unhealable.

Hrm. I could have sworn I read something about permanent scarring... I'll bow out to your lore-fu, however, since I can't find it. :/

-Evran

Crackling with unspent rage since 386A.V.
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/26/2009 11:58 PM CDT
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Heck, most pethians don't even do the eye gouging thing.



Dartenian says, "The thing that makes Dragon Dance king is that it pretty much bonuses every single that can possibly be buffed for combat. Including at least two things that don't even exist."
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Re: Role-Playing weakness on 08/27/2009 12:37 AM CDT
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Korsik has a birthmark in the shape of a squirrel wielding a bo staff on his left butt cheek.

- Korsik Rippentropp, Most Noble Paladine

Crusader against the Innocent
Defender of All That is Wrong in Elanthia
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