712 sucks? on 05/08/2014 07:31 PM CDT
Is this really intended? because it's quite simply one of the stupidest things I've seen in this game so far, broken IMHO.
On the off chance it actually does activate, it can kill you just as easily as if I sat there stunned?
PSR>
A bent being claws at you!
AS: +396 vs DS: +390 with AvD: +35 + d100 roll: +72 = +113
... and hits for 3 points of damage!
Poked in the tummy.
Hehehe.
A dark shadowy tendril rises up from your skin, writhes its way towards a bent being and lashes out malevolently...
Your surroundings blur for a moment . . .
[Basilica, Central Nave - 11897]
Obvious exits: north, east, south, west
Crackling is soon followed by the wild swirling of the shadowy ether around your skin.
You have overextended yourself!
You're in heavy shock!
The shadowy tendrils surrounding you begin to swirl faster and faster until they are just a blurred haze of quickly spiraling darkness.
The tendrils drain most of your life force.
... 60 points of damage!
Body pulped to a gooey mass.
You ooze to the ground.
Your SIGN OF DEFLECTION is no longer effective.
You feel your extra strength departing.
Your SIGN OF DEFENDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF WARDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF DISSIPATION is no longer effective.
The glowing specks of energy surrounding you suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.
A dark shadow seems to detach itself from your body, swiftly dissipating into the air.
The tingling sensation and sense of security leaves you.
You feel less confident than before.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around you.
The bright luminescence fades from around you.
The silvery luminescence fades from around you.
The very powerful look leaves you.
The white light leaves you.
The dull golden nimbus fades from around you.
The deep blue glow leaves you.
The powerful look leaves you.
The air calms down around you.
The light blue glow leaves you.
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/08/2014 09:56 PM CDT
From the spell description at: http://www.play.net/gs4/info/spells/spelllist.asp?circle=6#712
"If the retribution is used in conjunction with a spell that does not allow the shadow to strike out against a target (such as Spirit Guide or Planar Shift), it will still feel the need for violence and will turn upon its master."
Krakiipedia offers:
"If a non-attack spell is chanted, the cloak is guaranteed to strike back at its master, although the severity of said backlash is somewhat less severe (this occurs with 130 and 740). Otherwise, choice of spell has no influence on the outcome."
I do not use this ability but I suppose it could be helpful in certain situations. Perhaps another sorcerer will provide testimony.
"If the retribution is used in conjunction with a spell that does not allow the shadow to strike out against a target (such as Spirit Guide or Planar Shift), it will still feel the need for violence and will turn upon its master."
Krakiipedia offers:
"If a non-attack spell is chanted, the cloak is guaranteed to strike back at its master, although the severity of said backlash is somewhat less severe (this occurs with 130 and 740). Otherwise, choice of spell has no influence on the outcome."
I do not use this ability but I suppose it could be helpful in certain situations. Perhaps another sorcerer will provide testimony.
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/08/2014 10:55 PM CDT
As Silvean noted, the spell only attacks you like that if you're using it to escape. If an attack spell is used, it will only cause a backlash if you critically fail the activation roll.
The "off chance it actually does activate," incidentally, is 70% with no demonology lore, +1% for every two ranks to a maximum of 95%. It goes off pretty regularly if you meet the "something hits you while you're incapacitated" requirement.
Sometimes it kills you when it does that. Not all the time. Not even often. Sometimes, however, yes, especially if you've gotten low on health before it goes off. Even when it does kill you, you've been transported to a (hopefully) safe place before it finishes you off (in most cases).
I tend to find that if I am in a position where Cloak of Shadows can activate, I am probably about to die anyway. So, if I'm using it to escape, which I usually do, it turns almost-definitely-dead into sometimes-dead with some regularity. Given that this use is optional and attached to an already quite handy defensive spell, I don't really think that "this sucks" is how I would describe it.
-Rekarth's player
___________________________________________________________________
Astari says, "With the work you are doing, your safety is catamount."
The "off chance it actually does activate," incidentally, is 70% with no demonology lore, +1% for every two ranks to a maximum of 95%. It goes off pretty regularly if you meet the "something hits you while you're incapacitated" requirement.
Sometimes it kills you when it does that. Not all the time. Not even often. Sometimes, however, yes, especially if you've gotten low on health before it goes off. Even when it does kill you, you've been transported to a (hopefully) safe place before it finishes you off (in most cases).
I tend to find that if I am in a position where Cloak of Shadows can activate, I am probably about to die anyway. So, if I'm using it to escape, which I usually do, it turns almost-definitely-dead into sometimes-dead with some regularity. Given that this use is optional and attached to an already quite handy defensive spell, I don't really think that "this sucks" is how I would describe it.
-Rekarth's player
___________________________________________________________________
Astari says, "With the work you are doing, your safety is catamount."
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/08/2014 11:46 PM CDT
Which boils down to. You need 50 ranks of demonology for the best chance for it to work. Personally, I would continue to 52 ranks. The extra 2 ranks will take you to the next tier of phase.
I set my retribution to 708. I have aimed limb disruption and it is set to remove the right arm which is the weapon arm. No weapon? It can't hit you. Unless it is non corporeal undead. Or it doesn't have arms like water elementals.
Peace
Zhelas
(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
I set my retribution to 708. I have aimed limb disruption and it is set to remove the right arm which is the weapon arm. No weapon? It can't hit you. Unless it is non corporeal undead. Or it doesn't have arms like water elementals.
Peace
Zhelas
(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/09/2014 02:27 AM CDT
>Which boils down to. You need 50 ranks of demonology for the best chance for it to work. Personally, I would continue to 52 ranks. The extra 2 ranks will take you to the next tier of phase.
This.
708 is indeed a popular choice. For a long time my go-to was 118 because 1) TD pushdown 2) Most things web. I learned 140 around level 40 so my MnS CS was relatively decent. Now it's crap so I default to 130 pretty much all day long. One of my next goals is to crank out more demonology (I finally moved a bit past 52 recently) so I can use the "gold ring" 740 as my 712 retribution. During the CCF storyline I got smacked in the face by some tree spirit and accidentally my cloak fogged our whole group, which isn't always what you want. Besides that 740 on 712 just sounds cool.
Anyway, this will happen sometimes. I've never actually been killed by 130, so if you get the 50 ranks of demonology the chances are small. It will screw you up though, as the logs I posted on KP demonstrate clearly, and have been there for a while now.
Cheer up, you were going to die and instead you died in town.
daid (player of the temporally-challenged Harvest-Moon clan)
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.
This.
708 is indeed a popular choice. For a long time my go-to was 118 because 1) TD pushdown 2) Most things web. I learned 140 around level 40 so my MnS CS was relatively decent. Now it's crap so I default to 130 pretty much all day long. One of my next goals is to crank out more demonology (I finally moved a bit past 52 recently) so I can use the "gold ring" 740 as my 712 retribution. During the CCF storyline I got smacked in the face by some tree spirit and accidentally my cloak fogged our whole group, which isn't always what you want. Besides that 740 on 712 just sounds cool.
Anyway, this will happen sometimes. I've never actually been killed by 130, so if you get the 50 ranks of demonology the chances are small. It will screw you up though, as the logs I posted on KP demonstrate clearly, and have been there for a while now.
Cheer up, you were going to die and instead you died in town.
daid (player of the temporally-challenged Harvest-Moon clan)
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/10/2014 10:04 AM CDT
I used to hate 712, for the same reason I avoid using torment: it can kill you.
What made me a little more philosophical about the spell was a horrible mistake I made as a player. I was underhunting in the Jungle for skins. I had been away from the game for a while and was using this hunt as an opportunity to test out all of my spells for crowd control.
I was firing off 701, 708 and nightmare on everything I encountered. I wouldn’t kill until I had at least three critters in the same room as me. After a while I got a little punchy and started using 710 and torment. This was my mistake. As I knelt skin a viper, in an offensive stance and couple of trolls swarmed me, plucked my eye out and started beating me to death. My cloak of shadows was going crazy with 702.
So there I am, kneeling with a knife in hand, a torment running along side maelstorm when a party of 4 other characters walk in:
“Huh?”
“Oh my god.”
“What is that?”
“RUN!”
I survived using symbol of return and went off to find an empath. Back in town, the group of 4 has turned into a full dozen bent on discovering what crazy thing was happening in the Jungle. As near as I can tell, they thought it was an full on invasion.
I have never laughed so hard. There is a comedic side to sorcery.
Magarven the Mad
What made me a little more philosophical about the spell was a horrible mistake I made as a player. I was underhunting in the Jungle for skins. I had been away from the game for a while and was using this hunt as an opportunity to test out all of my spells for crowd control.
I was firing off 701, 708 and nightmare on everything I encountered. I wouldn’t kill until I had at least three critters in the same room as me. After a while I got a little punchy and started using 710 and torment. This was my mistake. As I knelt skin a viper, in an offensive stance and couple of trolls swarmed me, plucked my eye out and started beating me to death. My cloak of shadows was going crazy with 702.
So there I am, kneeling with a knife in hand, a torment running along side maelstorm when a party of 4 other characters walk in:
“Huh?”
“Oh my god.”
“What is that?”
“RUN!”
I survived using symbol of return and went off to find an empath. Back in town, the group of 4 has turned into a full dozen bent on discovering what crazy thing was happening in the Jungle. As near as I can tell, they thought it was an full on invasion.
I have never laughed so hard. There is a comedic side to sorcery.
Magarven the Mad
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/13/2014 08:51 AM CDT
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/13/2014 09:03 AM CDT
>If 712 didnt fire back at you when you put 130 or 740 into it, it would be the most broken spell in the game.
Would be, huh? It's kind of up there in my book as it is:
What's missing here?
>Demon is now your friend!
>Chaos!
>Demon smash!
...until it kills you...
daid (player of the temporally-challenged Harvest-Moon clan)
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.
Would be, huh? It's kind of up there in my book as it is:
Targeted attack spell | Demon angry | Demon lash out at target! |
Non-attack spell | Demon angry | Demon lash out at caster! |
What's missing here?
Area effect spell | Demon angry | Demon lash out at everything |
" | Demon neutral | AGAIN! |
" | Demon happy! | AND AGAIN! |
>Demon is now your friend!
>Chaos!
>Demon smash!
...until it kills you...
daid (player of the temporally-challenged Harvest-Moon clan)
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/13/2014 01:51 PM CDT
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/13/2014 11:09 PM CDT
Re: 712 sucks? on 05/17/2014 12:14 PM CDT
Speak of the devil, I got my first 712 lashback kill from Spirit Guide retribution yesterday. Still, my hunting partner was left dead in the Bowels and I was happily at the North Dock (and subsequently the Orchard). That's a slight annoyance that he died before me, and dying disbands group membership. I wish that would get fixed (so my demon would have brought my friend's dead corpse with me).
Still, Kaldonis is only level 83 and was hunting elders in the main Bowels area quite effectively. I got boiled, and had a chance after a short stun to fog (and stupidly did not, hadn't realized how many creatures entered the room and what all their capabilities are), and then we both got major ewaved. That killed my hunting partner and stunned me. A jarl I think pounded my face with a sledgehammer, which triggered my cloak, which by this time I think many people would already be dead. After all, I'm a halfling with limited health points and plain 6x robes. Just imagine if I was a more sane player and got some nice full leathers that were padded...
>(OOC) Rozy's player whispers to the group, "Spiiiiiderhalfling!"
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.
Still, Kaldonis is only level 83 and was hunting elders in the main Bowels area quite effectively. I got boiled, and had a chance after a short stun to fog (and stupidly did not, hadn't realized how many creatures entered the room and what all their capabilities are), and then we both got major ewaved. That killed my hunting partner and stunned me. A jarl I think pounded my face with a sledgehammer, which triggered my cloak, which by this time I think many people would already be dead. After all, I'm a halfling with limited health points and plain 6x robes. Just imagine if I was a more sane player and got some nice full leathers that were padded...
>(OOC) Rozy's player whispers to the group, "Spiiiiiderhalfling!"
>Out of no where, a ki-lin gallops in.