Cross-posted in Bards --> Developer's Corner - Bards

This is an issue I've noticed with my bards regarding multi-cast and the new MANA verb features. It may apply to certain other classes, as well.

There seems to be a problem with Mana Control ranks as they relate to multi-cast for bards. 30 ranks of Mental Mana Control (MMC) is not enough to obtain 2 multi-casts.

Bards may utilize both Mental Mana Control and Elemental Mana Control. The training costs are equal. Some of their basic bardic abilities, however--specifically Song of Unraveling--depend upon MMC, not EMC. Many bards train exclusively in MMC. But for some reason, it appears that Elemental Mana Control is considered a bard's "primary" control, while MMC is counting for only half.

I have verified this recently. Previously, both of my bards had 30 ranks of MMC with zero EMC. Neither one could utilize multi-casting; they were limited to 1 cast only. When I began training my elder bard in EMC, I noticed she could cast 2 multi-casts after training in only 10 ranks of EMC. This confirms that MMC is counting for only half (30/2 + 10 = 25).

It was my understanding that with classes that use two Mana Controls equally, whichever was trained higher was considered "prime" for purposes of determining what MANA features were available. For instance, my Sorcerer, who is equally trained in both Spiritual and Elemental mana controls, has not suffered this problem.

My ranger, on the other hand, has access to 2 multi-casts with only 25 ranks of Spiritual Mana Control.

It seems this may have been a minor oversight. We'd really appreciate it if you took a look at this and made any necessary adjustments.

Thank you! :)

Heathyr and friends

<<<I believe the circle required is based on which spell circle you are attempting to multi-cast. Minor Elemental, for example, would utilized EMC as the primary. >>>

Thanks for pointing that out, James. I was thinking that, as well, but it really doesn't make sense in the case of bards. Bard spellsongs can't be multi-cast, and bards do not have access to the Minor Mental circle. Since many, if not most, bards don't bother with EMC, it seems like they're getting left out in the cold regarding multi-cast. Maybe that's intended, but for such a convenient feature it seems more of an oversight rather than an intentional handicap.

~ Heathyr and friends

Let me add some perspective.

My ranger can multi-cast every spell she knows with only 25 ranks SMC. Ranger and MnS.
My empath can multi-cast every spell she knows with only 25 ranks SMC. Empath, MjS and MnS.
My wizard can multi-cast every spell she knows with only 25 ranks EMC. Wizard, MjE and MnE.

My bard with 30 ranks MMC can't multi-cast anything.
My bard with 30 ranks MMC and 15 ranks EMC can multi-cast MnE.
At 30/30 she'd still only have 2 multi-casts, while the others above would have 3.


That's the issue as I see it.

~ Heathyr

<<<Yes, but look at the benefits the bard circle holds aswell... If you fail a cast due to armor hindrance, you suffer no cast time nor a loss of mana. It has its ups and downs. You could multicast with 25 ranks of EMC and 0 ranks of MMC if you so decided.>>>

I think it's a bit disingenuous to being comparing class features unrelated to the MANA verb. This is a specific area of concern, not an overall balance issue. And while bards COULD forgo MMC in favor of EMC, their spellsongs do not benefit from EMC. We are encouraged to train in MMC as it supports both 1013 and 1040 (1013 is practically useless without MMC). Considering most bards will never train highly enough in any Mana Controls to gain use of MANA SPELLUP, this is a matter of sheer convenience.

I don't see any practical purpose in limiting bards from the use of this convenience. I don't think it's intentional, but could be remedied by simply adjusting the requirements a little.

~ Heathyr

All that being said, I wouldn't mind if the multicast function was tied to number of spells known in a circle instead of mana controls. It seems more of a convenience factor then a game breaking thing.

~James
Player of Septimius

I tend to basically agree with this...

http://forums.play.net/forums/GemStone%20IV/Bards/Developer's%20Corner%20-%20Bards/thread/1524698?get_newest=true

~James
Player of Septimius