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I wanted to ask how bard players feel about training in Ambush? Ambush is STILL the skill which determines success in ambushing from hiding, is it not? At one time, I think it was CM skill bonus? I don't know but mine has no ambush skill and I was thinking about making him 1x. He is a blunt and shield user, has 2x CM right now.
Any recommendations for lores, aside from that?
>>Do bards feel a need to ambush from the open a lot? Just hacking away seems a bit time consuming. Do bards spend the points?
Most physical bards that I know of are either pole-arm or edged users. It never takes long to kill something with a pole-arm and they aren't that easy to aim either. Edged users tend to pick up MoC so they can get more strikes in and not spend as much time hacking away. It also doesn't take much in the way of training to be able to aim edged weapons, for most just x1 in cman and dex/agl bonuses are enough but I think I've only ever seen one bard actually aiming. Both types will pick up air lore to increase the flares on their weapons and increase the benefits from tonis later in the game when they have the mana to run it. Tonis with 75 ranks of air lore takes three seconds off round times.
Most physical bards that I know of are either pole-arm or edged users. It never takes long to kill something with a pole-arm and they aren't that easy to aim either. Edged users tend to pick up MoC so they can get more strikes in and not spend as much time hacking away. It also doesn't take much in the way of training to be able to aim edged weapons, for most just x1 in cman and dex/agl bonuses are enough but I think I've only ever seen one bard actually aiming. Both types will pick up air lore to increase the flares on their weapons and increase the benefits from tonis later in the game when they have the mana to run it. Tonis with 75 ranks of air lore takes three seconds off round times.
Kraniak here--
Way back in the day I trained in ambush and OHE.
I would use 1005 and then leg them and then go for the head/neck/eye.
I am sure that is still a valid method for killing a critter.
With 1005, 410 and 1030 I would think you should be able to take the time to hunt in that manner and still control your room environment.
Way back in the day I trained in ambush and OHE.
I would use 1005 and then leg them and then go for the head/neck/eye.
I am sure that is still a valid method for killing a critter.
With 1005, 410 and 1030 I would think you should be able to take the time to hunt in that manner and still control your room environment.
I can't use lullabye much because of the mana it costs to renew! Keep in mind this bard is only 13th training;) I started singling in Ambush. Seems to have the points? He is hitting now. I don't see why not? He uses blunts. How do you survive with a polearm or thw/twc? Seems improbably low DS?
Assuming by TWC you meant Two Weapon Combat, it is a bit rough in the early levels, but quickly(By about 20) you can discover that bards can be some of the most effective TWCers out there as your spells can make up for lack of DS and eventually you can get nice physical redux(I probably have the most for my train out of any bard training planw ith my Bard currently).
If you meant Thrown Weapon Combat... you don't;) That weapon style is in bad shape across the board for any class and is supposedly under review currently, but I am not holding my breath for it to be done any time soon.
In as far as Lullabye, yes before about level 15 it can be rough to use that constantly(No renewal, it acts more like a spell than a song in this regard same mana cost every cast), but it is exceedingly effective, especially at lower levels and is a good way to protect yourself as well as being able to use it offensively as well.
If you meant Thrown Weapon Combat... you don't;) That weapon style is in bad shape across the board for any class and is supposedly under review currently, but I am not holding my breath for it to be done any time soon.
In as far as Lullabye, yes before about level 15 it can be rough to use that constantly(No renewal, it acts more like a spell than a song in this regard same mana cost every cast), but it is exceedingly effective, especially at lower levels and is a good way to protect yourself as well as being able to use it offensively as well.
Updating on my own thread, the open ambush thing works out nicely. It definitely is worth the TP's. He singles in Perception, CM and ambush. He hits right now at 14th level maybe half the time he aims? Maybe a it less but it's good for the low trainings he has. He is actually not yet singled in Ambush, come to think of it...I am catching up, so he probably has 9 ranks?
I tried sword and board and then moved to poles. It is pretty much like everyone said, one hit kills (air lore double/triple flares!) or you crit them and they are stunned.
Even my tiny elf can do well
**************************************
(Yukito makes a rude gesture at Rimalon's back.)
Speaking quietly to Rhandi, Marclar says, "I'm a limp noodle..."
http://katee.mybrute.com
Even my tiny elf can do well
**************************************
(Yukito makes a rude gesture at Rimalon's back.)
Speaking quietly to Rhandi, Marclar says, "I'm a limp noodle..."
http://katee.mybrute.com
Well, if I wanted to go no shield with less defense then I would just as well swing a claid? Poles - as in two-handers we are talking about, here? I have an alt which uses a lance and he gets tons of knock-downs and tons of crits, yes. His naginata, however is completely disappointing.
I have to ask about lores because don't know how to train. The 1x Ambush route is extremely worthwhile. At 15th training, he is getting several instant head kills a hunt and not 'parrying with the %^%' messenging much at all. When he misses, he still does a lot of damage. I just got him a 6x morning star with 3 kinds of flares so am curious about this double flaring jive as far as lore training. I used sonic shield once and it disappeared within a few minutes.
I have to ask about lores because don't know how to train. The 1x Ambush route is extremely worthwhile. At 15th training, he is getting several instant head kills a hunt and not 'parrying with the %^%' messenging much at all. When he misses, he still does a lot of damage. I just got him a 6x morning star with 3 kinds of flares so am curious about this double flaring jive as far as lore training. I used sonic shield once and it disappeared within a few minutes.
One thing is you can't sing up a sonic claid but lances are perfectly fine. I've heard quite a few people say they like their naginatas, however they certainly don't compare to lances. Two other reasons for polearms come to mind as well, cheaper training costs, and charge is just an insanely good maneuver.
For lores, I'd suggest you go with air, you get more sonic flares with your weapon, reduce penalties when using larger shield sizes, and reduced rts for tonis. 15 ranks of manipulation is needed to focus 1030, so that is a good goal. Telepathy is good for longer renew times, increased duration for tonis and provides a bonus to kia's.
For lores, I'd suggest you go with air, you get more sonic flares with your weapon, reduce penalties when using larger shield sizes, and reduced rts for tonis. 15 ranks of manipulation is needed to focus 1030, so that is a good goal. Telepathy is good for longer renew times, increased duration for tonis and provides a bonus to kia's.
Jeez, well that's just a ton of lores. I am content to single in Air but would need to be, what- 1.5x lores to get those increases?
My basic training plan is 1x PF, Shield, Spells, Perception, Ambush, CM and now Air Lore.
As far as singing up a claidhmore, then we would have to be able to sing up other weighted weapons as well, que no? And THW's as far as I'm concerned are really all about claids and lances. Two-hands is a lot to deal with when DS is already an issue with a shield and a weapon.
He is doing a goodly bit of damage with the blunt and aimed open ambush, don't see why I would make him a pole or THW user.
Ya, I want those double-triple ass flares! I have read about them and it's I guess 3% bonuses to the chance to get a third one with various air rank levels. The Krakiipedia site talked about it up to 102 ranks or so, around 35%+ chance to get a third flare? Is that consistent to the higher trained bards who get these working? And what about those secondary ones?
My blunt is flaring for between a measly 3 damage and up to 50.
All in all, it is unexpectedly fun being a bard.
My basic training plan is 1x PF, Shield, Spells, Perception, Ambush, CM and now Air Lore.
As far as singing up a claidhmore, then we would have to be able to sing up other weighted weapons as well, que no? And THW's as far as I'm concerned are really all about claids and lances. Two-hands is a lot to deal with when DS is already an issue with a shield and a weapon.
He is doing a goodly bit of damage with the blunt and aimed open ambush, don't see why I would make him a pole or THW user.
Ya, I want those double-triple ass flares! I have read about them and it's I guess 3% bonuses to the chance to get a third one with various air rank levels. The Krakiipedia site talked about it up to 102 ranks or so, around 35%+ chance to get a third flare? Is that consistent to the higher trained bards who get these working? And what about those secondary ones?
My blunt is flaring for between a measly 3 damage and up to 50.
All in all, it is unexpectedly fun being a bard.
For flares the benefits increase for every rank you gain. The others do have specific thresholds but the first ones aren't actually that high. You also can't do more then single in lores.
For shields:Training in Elemental Lore, Air reduces the shield hindrance when evading and attack. At 20 ranks, the bard's shield will be treated as being one size smaller for hindrance purposes. At 50 ranks, the bard's shield will be treated as being two sizes smaller, and at 100 Air Lore ranks, the shield will be treated as being three sizes smaller. In other words, a bard with 100 Air Lore ranks can use a sonic tower shield and only receive the hindrance of a small shield.
And Tonis:Training in Elemental Lore, Air will increase the dodge benefit of this song, and at certain thresholds, the haste effect will be increased (-1 second haste effect at 30 ranks, then again at 75 ranks). Dodging is increased from 1 Dodging rank at 1 rank of Air Lore, with the maximum being 20 Dodging ranks at 96 ranks of Air Lore.
The Dodge ranks are increased at the following Elemental Lore, Air thresholds:
1,2,3,5,8,10,14,17,21,26,31,36,42,49,55,63,70,78,87,96
You are correct that you can't sing up any weighted weapons.
For shields:Training in Elemental Lore, Air reduces the shield hindrance when evading and attack. At 20 ranks, the bard's shield will be treated as being one size smaller for hindrance purposes. At 50 ranks, the bard's shield will be treated as being two sizes smaller, and at 100 Air Lore ranks, the shield will be treated as being three sizes smaller. In other words, a bard with 100 Air Lore ranks can use a sonic tower shield and only receive the hindrance of a small shield.
And Tonis:Training in Elemental Lore, Air will increase the dodge benefit of this song, and at certain thresholds, the haste effect will be increased (-1 second haste effect at 30 ranks, then again at 75 ranks). Dodging is increased from 1 Dodging rank at 1 rank of Air Lore, with the maximum being 20 Dodging ranks at 96 ranks of Air Lore.
The Dodge ranks are increased at the following Elemental Lore, Air thresholds:
1,2,3,5,8,10,14,17,21,26,31,36,42,49,55,63,70,78,87,96
You are correct that you can't sing up any weighted weapons.
