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The NPC locksmiths have received an update and will now take boxes directly from your hands instead of requiring that you place them on the counter. For reference, they will still take boxes from the counter, but they'll check your hands first. Enjoy!
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
Do they hand them back to you when they are done or do you still have to get the unlocked box from the counter?
~Ifor, the tone deaf bard
Give a man a torch, he will be warm for an hour. Light a man of fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life.
http://twitter.com/#!/gssiforget
~Ifor, the tone deaf bard
Give a man a torch, he will be warm for an hour. Light a man of fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life.
http://twitter.com/#!/gssiforget
Thanks for this update. I will no longer have to do nasty things to scripting idiots who wander into the Locksmith's shop, interrupt my transaction, get a dozen or so boxes opened all at once, and then leave with one of my opened boxes (which was on the counter).
Fortunately I rarely have to ask the locksmith to open a box these days, but the point remains.
Maynist
Fortunately I rarely have to ask the locksmith to open a box these days, but the point remains.
Maynist
Wow. I didn't think you guys could make NPC Locksmiths even more over-efficient and easily automated than they already were. Clearly I was wrong.
Reasonable change, sure, but totally not what I thought this update was going to be about when I saw the title.
The L behind the Laphrael
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a shoe.
http://www.gsguide.net/index.php?title=Laphrael
Reasonable change, sure, but totally not what I thought this update was going to be about when I saw the title.
The L behind the Laphrael
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a shoe.
http://www.gsguide.net/index.php?title=Laphrael
>Reasonable change, sure, but totally not what I thought this update was going to be about when I saw the title
Yeah, I thought it was going to be something along the lines of "Now they will not totally gouge you so that the cost of opening the box is more than the worth of the contents."
~Ifor, the tone deaf bard
Give a man a torch, he will be warm for an hour. Light a man of fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life.
http://twitter.com/#!/gssiforget
Yeah, I thought it was going to be something along the lines of "Now they will not totally gouge you so that the cost of opening the box is more than the worth of the contents."
~Ifor, the tone deaf bard
Give a man a torch, he will be warm for an hour. Light a man of fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life.
http://twitter.com/#!/gssiforget
To answer a couple of the things said/commented on:
compliments: Thank you! I'm glad you like it! I do too.
LORDKRIP, this should get around the problem of a box being too big to fit on the counter. If it doesn't, let me know.
Laphrael, what were you expecting this to be about? Call it curiosity.
And Ifor, with this update some measures were put in place to help us evaluate the 'Price Gouging' of the locksmiths. I wouldn't say you should hold your breath, but we'll see what comes of that after I've had some time to look at the data.
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
compliments: Thank you! I'm glad you like it! I do too.
LORDKRIP, this should get around the problem of a box being too big to fit on the counter. If it doesn't, let me know.
Laphrael, what were you expecting this to be about? Call it curiosity.
And Ifor, with this update some measures were put in place to help us evaluate the 'Price Gouging' of the locksmiths. I wouldn't say you should hold your breath, but we'll see what comes of that after I've had some time to look at the data.
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
>>Laphrael, what were you expecting this to be about? Call it curiosity.
Honestly? Some means of actually decreasing the effectiveness of the NPC system to promote interaction with and use of PC smiths. It's been brought up several times in the past, and I'm pretty sure I'm in a very small minority here, but I personally think the NPC system is too instantaneous and risk free. The simplest solution, incur RT, but nobody likes the RT crutch. The fun solution, a chance to lose the entire box due to a botched trap or a chance to lose the most valuable item in the box due to sticky fingers. My minority is a sadistic one.
The L behind the Laphrael
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a shoe.
http://www.gsguide.net/index.php?title=Laphrael
Honestly? Some means of actually decreasing the effectiveness of the NPC system to promote interaction with and use of PC smiths. It's been brought up several times in the past, and I'm pretty sure I'm in a very small minority here, but I personally think the NPC system is too instantaneous and risk free. The simplest solution, incur RT, but nobody likes the RT crutch. The fun solution, a chance to lose the entire box due to a botched trap or a chance to lose the most valuable item in the box due to sticky fingers. My minority is a sadistic one.
The L behind the Laphrael
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a shoe.
http://www.gsguide.net/index.php?title=Laphrael
Thank you so much for this! It sounds like this should take care of the race condition where two people trying to use the locksmith at once could potentially clash and pay for the wrong box.
Incidentally, does this also eliminate (intentionally or otherwise) the weight limit of boxes the locksmith will open since I assume the box is never being placed onto the counter mechanically speaking?
Incidentally, does this also eliminate (intentionally or otherwise) the weight limit of boxes the locksmith will open since I assume the box is never being placed onto the counter mechanically speaking?
Problem is there isn't enough of you guys around anymore. Truth be told I was thinking they should examine the high cost of NPC pickers.
Not sure the best solution, but it is no fun to lug boxes around or throw them away because locksmiths are rarer. (Even in the East Tower in the Landing it is often a ghost town).
>Not sure the best solution, but it is no fun to lug boxes around or throw them away because locksmiths are rarer. (Even in the East Tower in the Landing it is often a ghost town)
MAZZAC
Circular problem.
There's no locksmiths on duty because there's no customers for the waiting locksmiths because the customer doesn't want to chance ever waiting around for locksmiths.
It'll take initiatives, GM system changes or otherwise <Player started>), to encourage people to use player locksmiths. Granted, I think the best fix would be to roll out changes to the NPC locksmith that make box picking there less convenient (RT, more box danger, etc as Laphrael said, or something else) mainly because while I admit there will be some growing pains (haha?) to start, once the demand for locksmiths increase, a good many of those rogues that used to pick, and don't anymore because of.. a lack of customers, will start coming back and the issue now (no customers/no pickers) will be lessened.
However, as this is surely a minority opinion, I'm open to other solutions. Anything to encourage more player locksmithing, and all the positive benefits of that, I'm for. Improvements to NPC locksmithing, or magical popping even, I'm not much in favor of at all.
-farmer
MAZZAC
Circular problem.
There's no locksmiths on duty because there's no customers for the waiting locksmiths because the customer doesn't want to chance ever waiting around for locksmiths.
It'll take initiatives, GM system changes or otherwise <Player started>), to encourage people to use player locksmiths. Granted, I think the best fix would be to roll out changes to the NPC locksmith that make box picking there less convenient (RT, more box danger, etc as Laphrael said, or something else) mainly because while I admit there will be some growing pains (haha?) to start, once the demand for locksmiths increase, a good many of those rogues that used to pick, and don't anymore because of.. a lack of customers, will start coming back and the issue now (no customers/no pickers) will be lessened.
However, as this is surely a minority opinion, I'm open to other solutions. Anything to encourage more player locksmithing, and all the positive benefits of that, I'm for. Improvements to NPC locksmithing, or magical popping even, I'm not much in favor of at all.
-farmer
I actually agree with Laphrael on this. Although I use the NPC locksmith a lot, I think it does take away a lot of what Gemstone is supposed to be about and the interaction with people. I would like to see a way to push people towards using locksmiths instead of the NPC except when none are available, not just a way to quickly run a script and be done with it.
-X
An idea comes to mind, but maybe the best way to get players the boxes to open is to move their picking spot to the room with the NPC locksmith? So then if you're there waiting for people to come by they'll hopefully decide to use your services instead of the NPC? On the other side, I hate that it would move such a renowned picking spot such as the East Tower to somewhere with much less history.
-Aulis
-Aulis
An idea comes to my mind too ... how about introducing a brief and self-contained storyline that links all the NPC locksmiths across Elanthia and the guild-that-should-not-be-named that establishes a new history and will encourage people to use our beleaguered PC locksmiths.
This is your mission, should you wish to accept it, Aulis!
~*~ She conquers, who endures ~*~
This is your mission, should you wish to accept it, Aulis!
~*~ She conquers, who endures ~*~
I'd be curious to hear more suggestions about this, so if people have them, please keep them coming.
On one side of the fence, I hear players that like the NPC Locksmith saying that it often gouges them so hard that they end up not having made any money from their boxes at all.
On the other side of the fence, I hear players saying that the NPC Locksmith needs to be more painful to use than it currently is in order for pickers to get more work.
If both sides are speaking truth here, what would be reasonable yet more painful than not making any money?
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
On one side of the fence, I hear players that like the NPC Locksmith saying that it often gouges them so hard that they end up not having made any money from their boxes at all.
On the other side of the fence, I hear players saying that the NPC Locksmith needs to be more painful to use than it currently is in order for pickers to get more work.
If both sides are speaking truth here, what would be reasonable yet more painful than not making any money?
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
Trash bins outside of the local locksmith shops sounds like a good idea to me in theory, but we would have to see if the town gurus agree with that sentiment.
Picking Pockets may also have some hope at last with a move like this. Since those seen using the local NPC locksmith instead of the player ones on a regular basis could easily become known "marks" in that town. Rogue justice, right?
Also, one of the benefits of having an MHO with Tier 3 status is a portable trash bin (three cheers to GM Kenstrom for that!). Players in such a position could easily take advantage of this opportunity as well if the gurus decide there are already too many or enough trash bins in their town as it is.
;)
GM Marstreforn
Picking Pockets may also have some hope at last with a move like this. Since those seen using the local NPC locksmith instead of the player ones on a regular basis could easily become known "marks" in that town. Rogue justice, right?
Also, one of the benefits of having an MHO with Tier 3 status is a portable trash bin (three cheers to GM Kenstrom for that!). Players in such a position could easily take advantage of this opportunity as well if the gurus decide there are already too many or enough trash bins in their town as it is.
;)
GM Marstreforn
For every box a NPC opens, -10 unabsorbed experience. And every box a PC locksmith opens, +10 for the one that handed it to him!
Jesting aside, after having played a rogue for a stint of many years, I found that it was rarely viable, experience-wise, to just sit and locksmith for people. If there were more experienced gained from it for the locksmith then I think more would be inclined to do so.
But these opinions are just from a personal perspective and not a GM.
-Aulis
Jesting aside, after having played a rogue for a stint of many years, I found that it was rarely viable, experience-wise, to just sit and locksmith for people. If there were more experienced gained from it for the locksmith then I think more would be inclined to do so.
But these opinions are just from a personal perspective and not a GM.
-Aulis
>On one side of the fence, I hear players that like the NPC Locksmith saying that it often gouges them so hard that they end up not having made any money from their boxes at all.
This is only because they just count the silvers and not all the other loot. The NPC could charge more, particularly on the wealthier boxes. Remove the cap on the charge.
This is only because they just count the silvers and not all the other loot. The NPC could charge more, particularly on the wealthier boxes. Remove the cap on the charge.
On one side of the fence, I hear players that like the NPC Locksmith saying that it often gouges them so hard that they end up not having made any money from their boxes at all.
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
This has been my experience. I rarely if ever use NPC locksmiths because of this. The only real thing you may gain are special box finds or rare jewelry items with spells etc.
In general, taking the box to the NPC is just about the same as throwing it away.
I think that the problem from the rogue vantage point is tied directly to the loss of population in the game.
One solution: If there are PC locksmiths in your general level range on duty in whatever location you are in; then the NPC should charge higher rates, etc. If there are no PC locksmiths on duty, the NPC should charge similar to common tipping (10% value of box or so/cap 1000 sp at high end?)
Chris
Gamemaster Konacon
Squares Team
This has been my experience. I rarely if ever use NPC locksmiths because of this. The only real thing you may gain are special box finds or rare jewelry items with spells etc.
In general, taking the box to the NPC is just about the same as throwing it away.
I think that the problem from the rogue vantage point is tied directly to the loss of population in the game.
One solution: If there are PC locksmiths in your general level range on duty in whatever location you are in; then the NPC should charge higher rates, etc. If there are no PC locksmiths on duty, the NPC should charge similar to common tipping (10% value of box or so/cap 1000 sp at high end?)
Chris
The answer is to cut down the RT for traps and locks. Barring that, no one seems to want to waste their precious time. 3-7 seconds to disarm and 3 seconds to unlock. Part of the issue is scripters but mostly it is about time. Reduce it and perhaps you'll find people more willing to stand in a line.
~Galenok
~Galenok
I think GM Aulis' idea of having pickers set up in the same room as NPC pickers is brilliant. I know I'm getting gouged by the NPC pickers with their fees, but I consider that the price I pay for the convenience of not having to find a picker or wait for one to become available, or standing in the East Tower possibly getting my pockets lightened while I wait for my boxes. I would be much more inclined to use a PC picker if I head to the locksmith and I see one is available, with a ready alternative if there are none.
I also like the other poster's idea of reducing the RT to something more manageable, though my suggestion is to use Disarm, Unlock, and Perception skills in a formula to train down the RT to a max of 4 seconds to disarm and 8 seconds to unlock. A highly skilled picker should spot traps and pick boxes quicker than a novice picker who has not invested as much training.
--
Just my two cents, but in a currency with an exchange rate worth more than yours.
I also like the other poster's idea of reducing the RT to something more manageable, though my suggestion is to use Disarm, Unlock, and Perception skills in a formula to train down the RT to a max of 4 seconds to disarm and 8 seconds to unlock. A highly skilled picker should spot traps and pick boxes quicker than a novice picker who has not invested as much training.
--
Just my two cents, but in a currency with an exchange rate worth more than yours.
The NPC locksmith currently charges based on the difficulty of the lock and trap and the value of the contents. Often, boxes from OTF or other over-hunted end-game areas with very difficult traps and very little value cost more to open than they contain. That is the essence of the problem of locksmith "cost."
~ Nuadjha, the Briar Fox
You inhale deeply upon your pipe, puckering your lips as you send out three rings of smoke before you, then puff out a small vine of smoke that darts right through all three which causes them to disperse in a hazy shroud!
~ Nuadjha, the Briar Fox
You inhale deeply upon your pipe, puckering your lips as you send out three rings of smoke before you, then puff out a small vine of smoke that darts right through all three which causes them to disperse in a hazy shroud!
How about if a player smith is present, the NPC subcontracts to them?
...
>Ask Galena about work
Galena turns to you and says, "For 20% of the fee I collect, I will employ you to pick the next box I receive"
Scriptingdude just came in
Scriptingdude had a quiet word with Galena
"Hello Scriptingdude", says Galena, "today I am training an apprentice so it will take a little longer to open your boxes. In recognition of this I shall reduce my fee to 80% of its normal level."
Galena turns to you and orders, "unlock this scratched mithril trunk within the next minute for 327 silvers or you'll get no more work from me today"
>.pickscript mithril trunk
(various picking stuff)
Galena congratulates you on your work and pays you 327 silvers before returning the trunk to Scriptingdude
...
If the box has a trap or lock larger than your record, the NPC will just say that it looks to be too tough for you and open themself as normal.
If you are about to set off a trap the NPC will intervene and give you a severe beating (with injury consequences similar to what the trap would have done) before throwing you out and will refuse to give you any more work for the next 24 hours.
...
>disarm mithril trunk
Something was just about to go horribly wrong when Galena roughly pulled you away from the trunk. "Idiot", she screams, "that's the wrong way to disarm a boomer." She clouts you over the head, stunning you, before throwing you out the door. Shortly afterwards she appears with a vial in her hand which she pours over you and ignites. "Thats what happens when you set off a boomer. Don't ask for any more work until you have learnt how to do it properly." You estimate it will be at least 24 hours before she is calm enough to employ you again, always assuming that an empath and cleric have attended to you first.
DEAD>
...
>Ask Galena about work
Galena turns to you and says, "For 20% of the fee I collect, I will employ you to pick the next box I receive"
Scriptingdude just came in
Scriptingdude had a quiet word with Galena
"Hello Scriptingdude", says Galena, "today I am training an apprentice so it will take a little longer to open your boxes. In recognition of this I shall reduce my fee to 80% of its normal level."
Galena turns to you and orders, "unlock this scratched mithril trunk within the next minute for 327 silvers or you'll get no more work from me today"
>.pickscript mithril trunk
(various picking stuff)
Galena congratulates you on your work and pays you 327 silvers before returning the trunk to Scriptingdude
...
If the box has a trap or lock larger than your record, the NPC will just say that it looks to be too tough for you and open themself as normal.
If you are about to set off a trap the NPC will intervene and give you a severe beating (with injury consequences similar to what the trap would have done) before throwing you out and will refuse to give you any more work for the next 24 hours.
...
>disarm mithril trunk
Something was just about to go horribly wrong when Galena roughly pulled you away from the trunk. "Idiot", she screams, "that's the wrong way to disarm a boomer." She clouts you over the head, stunning you, before throwing you out the door. Shortly afterwards she appears with a vial in her hand which she pours over you and ignites. "Thats what happens when you set off a boomer. Don't ask for any more work until you have learnt how to do it properly." You estimate it will be at least 24 hours before she is calm enough to employ you again, always assuming that an empath and cleric have attended to you first.
DEAD>
>Something was just about to go horribly wrong when Galena roughly pulled you away from the trunk. "Idiot", she screams, "that's the wrong way to disarm a boomer." She clouts you over the head, stunning you, before throwing you out the door. Shortly afterwards she appears with a vial in her hand which she pours over you and ignites. "Thats what happens when you set off a boomer. Don't ask for any more work until you have learnt how to do it properly." You estimate it will be at least 24 hours before she is calm enough to employ you again, always assuming that an empath and cleric have attended to you first.
This is hilarious. What a teaching method!
~ Nuadjha, the Briar Fox
You inhale deeply upon your pipe, puckering your lips as you send out three rings of smoke before you, then puff out a small vine of smoke that darts right through all three which causes them to disperse in a hazy shroud!
This is hilarious. What a teaching method!
~ Nuadjha, the Briar Fox
You inhale deeply upon your pipe, puckering your lips as you send out three rings of smoke before you, then puff out a small vine of smoke that darts right through all three which causes them to disperse in a hazy shroud!
Some excellent ideas Rathboner...and WAY funny.
The only thing missing is the fine for setting off a trap, not sure how to incorporate that. I know many folks would like to NOT be fined for setting off traps, but for the more dangerous ones I think it makes sense that the law does get involved.
This isn't normal!
What do you mean this isn't normal!?!
This is way worse!!
The only thing missing is the fine for setting off a trap, not sure how to incorporate that. I know many folks would like to NOT be fined for setting off traps, but for the more dangerous ones I think it makes sense that the law does get involved.
This isn't normal!
What do you mean this isn't normal!?!
This is way worse!!
Add a roundtime similar to that found in the lockmastery contest for NPC pickers instead of a high charge. A master locksmith should not spend less time disarming when in actuality if a trap is present, detecting is usually only 5 to 15 seconds. The long detect on untrapped boxes reflects a thorough investigation for trap.
As a GM, I notice lots of characters seem to be in a rush nowadays. Mostly everyone running around, no sitting idle, min/maxing their time to get best exp absorption. If they aren't sitting on a super node, it's not time well spent. It's troubling even from a GM perspective, because when we do try to interact with you, it quickly turns into an AFK script check.
Automation seems to become a way of normal gameplay now. I think the locksmith update is a huge boon for instances like Platinum and Shattered where automation is needed due to a lack of player services.
____
~Wyrom, ASGM
Host Manager
GameMaster Trainer
Platinum Lackey
Honorary QCer
>>Glitch uncertainly says, "I need pictures for this."
Automation seems to become a way of normal gameplay now. I think the locksmith update is a huge boon for instances like Platinum and Shattered where automation is needed due to a lack of player services.
____
~Wyrom, ASGM
Host Manager
GameMaster Trainer
Platinum Lackey
Honorary QCer
>>Glitch uncertainly says, "I need pictures for this."
<I like the idea of PC and NPC locksmiths being the same spot. For the landing - have Edwina finally kick Larton out completely and put him on the second floor of the tower. Something similar could be done for most other towns I would think.>
This could be acceptable. People who hunt at odd hours or in odd places shouldn't be penalized even more than they already are if there's a lack of working pickers though. One thing I would like to recommend though is that it be outside justice boundries if this is done :D!
This could be acceptable. People who hunt at odd hours or in odd places shouldn't be penalized even more than they already are if there's a lack of working pickers though. One thing I would like to recommend though is that it be outside justice boundries if this is done :D!
How about if the NPC locksmith, if there are PC locksmiths in the room of a skill level that the box could be picked by, takes a long time while he/she "instructs the nearby apprentices" - ie, RT for using the NPC. Perhaps also charge a bit more, including a "You really may want to talk to one of these others - I'm a bit busy right now. I can do it, but it'll cost you a bit extra."
~Godefroy
Morvule hisses, "Ssssally ssssellssss sssseashellssss by the sssseasssshore."
~Godefroy
Morvule hisses, "Ssssally ssssellssss sssseashellssss by the sssseasssshore."
