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The long-standing bug in YS where you would erroneously get the "but are unable to compress the air further" message was found and fixed yesterday.
Due to some other testing, a couple numbers had been modified slightly and were released with that fix (which is why a couple folks have noticed small changes but others have noticed nothing at all).
With the global preview coming to an end, we want to make certain that these numbers are fixed and finalized. We absolutely want to minimize the chance of anything changing once someone has chosen a spell.
A version of YS is being released as I write this post. There are a couple small changes which will, I'm sure, impact the max results some of you will see. Some characters won't see any differences at all (it really depends where you fall in the messaging ranges). In all likelihood, it is just a 1% difference causing the messaging change. I would imagine the ones most likely to notice the change will be those with multiple, high hinderance accessories (but others might see a change as well.
As a result of this change, YS will remain on global preview for an extra week. I can't fathom that anyone who would have selected it before would change their mind based on this but we want there to be certainty with how your spells will perform.
I know that there will be posts of 'downtweak', etc. If you feel something looks grieviously incorrect, post on it and we will certainly have a look at it.
GM Damissak
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently insignificantly hindered.
Ever since new magic I've been unhindered unhindered..Shoot even before The magic changes I think I might have been unhindered unhindered With Ys up. I also think i'm getting a short spell duration. With over 300's in magic and a 50 mana cast I got 23 minutes...I could be wrong though..and by the way I just tried 55 mana and got the EXACT same results..Still insig and exactly 23 minute cast..Something doesn't seem right here. I'm in all Chain armor also.
Kitain
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently insignificantly hindered.
Ever since new magic I've been unhindered unhindered..Shoot even before The magic changes I think I might have been unhindered unhindered With Ys up. I also think i'm getting a short spell duration. With over 300's in magic and a 50 mana cast I got 23 minutes...I could be wrong though..and by the way I just tried 55 mana and got the EXACT same results..Still insig and exactly 23 minute cast..Something doesn't seem right here. I'm in all Chain armor also.
Kitain
>A version of YS is being released as I write this post. There are a couple small changes which will, I'm sure, impact the max results some of you will see. Some characters won't see any differences at all (it really depends where you fall in the messaging ranges). In all likelihood, it is just a 1% difference causing the messaging change. I would imagine the ones most likely to notice the change will be those with multiple, high hinderance accessories (but others might see a change as well.
Going from my LC setup as unhindered(which I could get with about half of my max mana) to lightly now with the max mana I can put in the spell is a bit more than 1%. If this will be the final form of this spell, I dont see myself getting it anymore. I will try my HP setup later on.
Going from my LC setup as unhindered(which I could get with about half of my max mana) to lightly now with the max mana I can put in the spell is a bit more than 1%. If this will be the final form of this spell, I dont see myself getting it anymore. I will try my HP setup later on.
Having just gotten a chance to test it...
Erm, it's a lot more than a 1% difference. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume this is accidental, so I'm not going to complain. Instead, I shall simply say:
Please fix. If a 60-mana cast isn't making all that much of a difference, there's a problem.
Erm, it's a lot more than a 1% difference. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume this is accidental, so I'm not going to complain. Instead, I shall simply say:
Please fix. If a 60-mana cast isn't making all that much of a difference, there's a problem.
A bit more info.
LC setup - LC hauberk, LP helm, HP gauntlets, ironwood buckler.
Before YS.
You feel certain that a chain hauberk appears to impose moderate maneuvering hindrance and offers:
good protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be insignificantly hindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
You feel certain that an armet helm appears to impose insignificant maneuvering hindrance and offers:
moderate protection and good damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for slice attacks.
low protection and good damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and moderate damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and moderate damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and moderate damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in an armet helm you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
You feel certain that some gauntlets appear to impose fair maneuvering hindrance and offers:
high protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
great protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in some gauntlets you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
With YS close to my cap.
You feel certain that a chain hauberk appears to impose fair maneuvering hindrance and offers:
good protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and high damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
You feel certain that some gauntlets appear to impose light maneuvering hindrance and offers:
high protection and great damage absorption for puncture attacks.
great protection and great damage absorption for slice attacks.
good protection and great damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and high damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in some gauntlets you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
You feel certain that an armet helm appears to impose insignificant maneuvering hindrance and offers:
moderate protection and good damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for slice attacks.
low protection and good damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in an armet helm you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
So hauberk went from moderate to fair, helm from insignificant to insignificant, gauntlets fair to light.
The benefit I get from the spell is less than half that I used to. Is 1 range worth of hinderance drop worth of a spellslot and 60+ mana?
LC setup - LC hauberk, LP helm, HP gauntlets, ironwood buckler.
Before YS.
You feel certain that a chain hauberk appears to impose moderate maneuvering hindrance and offers:
good protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be insignificantly hindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
You feel certain that an armet helm appears to impose insignificant maneuvering hindrance and offers:
moderate protection and good damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for slice attacks.
low protection and good damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and moderate damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and moderate damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and moderate damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in an armet helm you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
You feel certain that some gauntlets appear to impose fair maneuvering hindrance and offers:
high protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
great protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in some gauntlets you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
With YS close to my cap.
You feel certain that a chain hauberk appears to impose fair maneuvering hindrance and offers:
good protection and high damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for slice attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for impact attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and high damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
You feel certain that some gauntlets appear to impose light maneuvering hindrance and offers:
high protection and great damage absorption for puncture attacks.
great protection and great damage absorption for slice attacks.
good protection and great damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and high damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and high damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and high damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in some gauntlets you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
You feel certain that an armet helm appears to impose insignificant maneuvering hindrance and offers:
moderate protection and good damage absorption for puncture attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for slice attacks.
low protection and good damage absorption for impact attacks.
good protection and good damage absorption for fire attacks.
moderate protection and good damage absorption for cold attacks.
poor protection and good damage absorption for electrical attacks.
If you were only maneuvering in an armet helm you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
So hauberk went from moderate to fair, helm from insignificant to insignificant, gauntlets fair to light.
The benefit I get from the spell is less than half that I used to. Is 1 range worth of hinderance drop worth of a spellslot and 60+ mana?
<<In all likelihood, it is just a 1% difference causing the messaging change. I would imagine the ones most likely to notice the change will be those with multiple, high hinderance accessories (but others might see a change as well.
I went from unhindered/unhindered to unhindered/lightly hindered. That's not a 1% change. Very discouraging. Yes, I wear plate assessories, but still... I had thought the whole release philosophy was supposed to be to release on the conservative side and uptweak as necessisary to avoid having to downtweak things after players try them out.
I'm not going to rant, though. In fact, I'm going to settle with simply slapping myself for optimistically believing that the inevitable wouldn't happen. I play a warrior mage, after all.
I went from unhindered/unhindered to unhindered/lightly hindered. That's not a 1% change. Very discouraging. Yes, I wear plate assessories, but still... I had thought the whole release philosophy was supposed to be to release on the conservative side and uptweak as necessisary to avoid having to downtweak things after players try them out.
I'm not going to rant, though. In fact, I'm going to settle with simply slapping myself for optimistically believing that the inevitable wouldn't happen. I play a warrior mage, after all.
I don't know what happened to my baby YS but lets fix it.
First off duration, I'm casting it at 2 minutes less then before your change with the same man.
and armor hinderence has chanced from:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
to
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently unhindered.
The only people out there who proably don't see difference or animal skin wearers
Light
First off duration, I'm casting it at 2 minutes less then before your change with the same man.
and armor hinderence has chanced from:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
to
If you were only maneuvering in a chain hauberk you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently unhindered.
The only people out there who proably don't see difference or animal skin wearers
Light
If this is the way YS is going to stay I highly doubt Ill even bother getting it. Costs more mana to do less than it did before. Hopefully they are still fiddling with it and it will show an increase in effectiveness. Was anyone able to test it wearing all of one type of armor? If so were your results similiar to the former posts?
I just wanted to also say that my whole armor set-up is forged.
Without YS:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be insignificantly hindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
With YS (old), 25 prep:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently unhindered.
With YS (now), 50 prep:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
Also, when I remove my shield to put it in my hand, it raises one more step. But, I also wear multiple armors.. personally, I don't like the change, but at least lightly is better then fairly. Ill just keep training my armors like usual, until Im unhindered without YS (I can dream, right?).
Master Ndin, father of the Brutal Gnome
Without YS:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be insignificantly hindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently fairly hindered.
With YS (old), 25 prep:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently unhindered.
With YS (now), 50 prep:
If you were only maneuvering in a chain shirt you would be unhindered.
But considering all the armor and shields you are wearing or carrying, you are currently lightly hindered.
Also, when I remove my shield to put it in my hand, it raises one more step. But, I also wear multiple armors.. personally, I don't like the change, but at least lightly is better then fairly. Ill just keep training my armors like usual, until Im unhindered without YS (I can dream, right?).
Master Ndin, father of the Brutal Gnome
Do you think that maybe the experience system could be altered so that armor skill doesn't contribute to a mucked up state of mind? The changes to YS have forced me to reluctantly abandon training multiple armors, and as a result I find myself overfilling my light chain armor pool as a result of wearing all chain.
Also, I'll probably have some forged plate for sale sometime soon. I bought it based on my previous results with YS. Of course, I couldn't know at the time that we would be surprised with a negative adjustment to the spell four days before the end of the preview, so it seemed a good buy at the time.
By the way, does anyone know about how many ranks in heavy plate that it takes for a warror mage to reach minimum hinderance for the guild?
Also, I'll probably have some forged plate for sale sometime soon. I bought it based on my previous results with YS. Of course, I couldn't know at the time that we would be surprised with a negative adjustment to the spell four days before the end of the preview, so it seemed a good buy at the time.
By the way, does anyone know about how many ranks in heavy plate that it takes for a warror mage to reach minimum hinderance for the guild?
>By the way, does anyone know about how many ranks in heavy plate that it takes for a warror mage to reach minimum hinderance for the guild?
It takes a pallie about 150 ranks to reach minimum in HP hinderance I heard. So if our HP hinderance is still about 50%, then 75 is where WMs reach minimum hinderance with HP armor pieces I think.
Jutus the Canned
It takes a pallie about 150 ranks to reach minimum in HP hinderance I heard. So if our HP hinderance is still about 50%, then 75 is where WMs reach minimum hinderance with HP armor pieces I think.
Jutus the Canned
Well it seems like more than 1% to me as well. Before I was swapping between unhindered\insignifigant, depending on whatever randomness there is in the spell with my max cast of 60. Now I'm lightly hindered in my armor casting at 60. Quite a big difference that.
Why didn't you tweak it 1% up instead of 1% down?
Is it considered to be using multiple armor types and do you get a hinderance penalty for wearing mixed light chain and heavy chain, or light plate and heavy plate?, I've heard all plate or all chain isn't mixed armor but haven't been able to actually confirm it.
It's great that bugs fixed, though I've learned to wait till it wears off and recast as I conserve alot of mana that way, so I vote for putting the bug back in!, now don't everyone lynch me at once...
Beliel
Why didn't you tweak it 1% up instead of 1% down?
Is it considered to be using multiple armor types and do you get a hinderance penalty for wearing mixed light chain and heavy chain, or light plate and heavy plate?, I've heard all plate or all chain isn't mixed armor but haven't been able to actually confirm it.
It's great that bugs fixed, though I've learned to wait till it wears off and recast as I conserve alot of mana that way, so I vote for putting the bug back in!, now don't everyone lynch me at once...
Beliel
<<It's great that bugs fixed, though I've learned to wait till it wears off and recast as I conserve alot of mana that way, so I vote for putting the bug back in!, now don't everyone lynch me at once...>>
I don't see why anyone would lynch you; I'd take the bug over this version of the spell, any day of the week.
The only reason I didn't raise more cain about YS's duration being so much lower than it once was, was because of the increase in effectiveness elsewhere (absorption). Now it caps at ~30 minutes (even Paladins can beat this with courage), doesn't give as much of a bonus to absorption, and doesn't seem to reduce the hindrance near as much as it did a couple of days ago.
I guess this is a perfect example of why we should just let the GMs call certain things a "feature" and deal with it.
I don't see why anyone would lynch you; I'd take the bug over this version of the spell, any day of the week.
The only reason I didn't raise more cain about YS's duration being so much lower than it once was, was because of the increase in effectiveness elsewhere (absorption). Now it caps at ~30 minutes (even Paladins can beat this with courage), doesn't give as much of a bonus to absorption, and doesn't seem to reduce the hindrance near as much as it did a couple of days ago.
I guess this is a perfect example of why we should just let the GMs call certain things a "feature" and deal with it.
I didn't mean to seem contrary, Z-E. Your point is taken.
>> Would it be possible to concider evaluating reinstating that "1%" diffrence? It did not seem to be overpowered and it allowed some use of mixed armor.
While I agree that folks like to see 'unhindered' vs 'insignificantly' hindered, realize that these are just messaging scales. Being at X% hinderance and getting an unhindered message vs being at (X+1)% hinderance and being insignificantly hindered is no difference in terms of usefulness (and yes, I know that some experienced more change than that depending on armor type and total armor components.. I apologize for understating the impact in those cases).
YS is a fantastic spell in terms of what it does. It does still allow use of multiple armor. It does not completely eliminate the penalty for doing so (the penalty is there for a reason as there is a wonderful TDP advantage to being able to do it).
GM Damissak
>> Would it be possible to concider evaluating reinstating that "1%" diffrence? It did not seem to be overpowered and it allowed some use of mixed armor.
While I agree that folks like to see 'unhindered' vs 'insignificantly' hindered, realize that these are just messaging scales. Being at X% hinderance and getting an unhindered message vs being at (X+1)% hinderance and being insignificantly hindered is no difference in terms of usefulness (and yes, I know that some experienced more change than that depending on armor type and total armor components.. I apologize for understating the impact in those cases).
YS is a fantastic spell in terms of what it does. It does still allow use of multiple armor. It does not completely eliminate the penalty for doing so (the penalty is there for a reason as there is a wonderful TDP advantage to being able to do it).
GM Damissak
