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hey when you fixed brawling, did you really fix it?
check this out
Brawling: 121 56.32% clear
>grap
You reach out and grab hold of a rock troll, but it breaks away easily.
[You're nimbly balanced and opponent has slight advantage.]
Roundtime: 3 sec.
am I supposed to not be able to grapple em anymore?
just curiuos
I don't understand why learning offhand by punching with my left hand should not award experience for offhand. It is silly for it not to. All that was done was remove an perfectly good way to learn offhand skill.
[S]>glance
You glance down to see a bastard sword in your right hand and nothing in your left hand.
[S]>attack left
< Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you punch your spiked knuckle at a snowbeast. A snowbeast attempts to dodge, leaning wrong and blundering into the blow.
The knuckle lands a solid hit to the snowbeast's left leg.
[You're incredibly balanced and in very strong position.]
[Roundtime 2 sec.]
Give me 1 good reason why I shouldn't learn offhand skill from that.
[S]>glance
You glance down to see a bastard sword in your right hand and nothing in your left hand.
[S]>attack left
< Driving in like the irresistable force of a cyclone, you punch your spiked knuckle at a snowbeast. A snowbeast attempts to dodge, leaning wrong and blundering into the blow.
The knuckle lands a solid hit to the snowbeast's left leg.
[You're incredibly balanced and in very strong position.]
[Roundtime 2 sec.]
Give me 1 good reason why I shouldn't learn offhand skill from that.
I believe the reason was because it awarded OH experience while using brawling.
Essentially you could start with 0 OH and 400 brawling and start moving OH in your current "at-level" hunting area. Basically the attack didn't take into account your OH skill when performing the move.
-Galren Moonskin
>>Now watch closely, everyone. I'm going to show you how to kill a god. A god of life and death. The trick is not to fear him.
Essentially you could start with 0 OH and 400 brawling and start moving OH in your current "at-level" hunting area. Basically the attack didn't take into account your OH skill when performing the move.
-Galren Moonskin
>>Now watch closely, everyone. I'm going to show you how to kill a god. A god of life and death. The trick is not to fear him.
Let's knock it off with the cheeky remarks. They aren't constructive, they don't encourage discussion, they serve no purpose. Other snide remarks like this will inspire me to pull posts and become very ....cranky. --Arhia
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and the lightning bug." --Mark Twain
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and the lightning bug." --Mark Twain
"I believe the reason was because it awarded OH experience while using brawling.
Essentially you could start with 0 OH and 400 brawling and start moving OH in your current "at-level" hunting area. Basically the attack didn't take into account your OH skill when performing the move."
...If that is the case, the worst case scenario would be a high level person working a low skill in things they normally hunt. That is not a very big deal.
If there was some bug then let a low circle person hunt way out of their league because of punching with their left hand. Then there would be a problem, but the fact that only learning from offhand brawling and not the ability to do it was removed suggests there was no such problem.
The logical thing would to be fix the coding problem. Not remove a perfectly good way to work offhand skill and call that "a fix" Please do not be offended by this, I am not trying to rip on the GM's who work hard on improving DR, but that is just being lazy.
I always thought the GM's strived for adding more ways to work skills. Please just 1 good reason from a GM for why this was done.
Essentially you could start with 0 OH and 400 brawling and start moving OH in your current "at-level" hunting area. Basically the attack didn't take into account your OH skill when performing the move."
...If that is the case, the worst case scenario would be a high level person working a low skill in things they normally hunt. That is not a very big deal.
If there was some bug then let a low circle person hunt way out of their league because of punching with their left hand. Then there would be a problem, but the fact that only learning from offhand brawling and not the ability to do it was removed suggests there was no such problem.
The logical thing would to be fix the coding problem. Not remove a perfectly good way to work offhand skill and call that "a fix" Please do not be offended by this, I am not trying to rip on the GM's who work hard on improving DR, but that is just being lazy.
I always thought the GM's strived for adding more ways to work skills. Please just 1 good reason from a GM for why this was done.
>If that is the case, the worst case scenario would be a high level person working a low skill in things they normally hunt. That is not a very big deal.
That was indeed the situation.
>The logical thing would to be fix the coding problem. Not remove a perfectly good way to work offhand skill and call that "a fix" Please do not be offended by this, I am not trying to rip on the GM's who work hard on improving DR, but that is just being lazy.
I'm not sure that it actually was an easier fix, but this was Oolan's vision of the skill. I've already made it clear that I don't agree. But the bottom line is, suck it up because it isn't changing.
That was indeed the situation.
>The logical thing would to be fix the coding problem. Not remove a perfectly good way to work offhand skill and call that "a fix" Please do not be offended by this, I am not trying to rip on the GM's who work hard on improving DR, but that is just being lazy.
I'm not sure that it actually was an easier fix, but this was Oolan's vision of the skill. I've already made it clear that I don't agree. But the bottom line is, suck it up because it isn't changing.
All combat should be ambidextrous. Right- and left-hand usage should defaultly be determined based on the ratio between weapon skill and offhand skill (effective or base? hmm...) such that any combat command that doesn't specifically include a RIGHT or LEFT keyword randomly chooses either hand based on that ratio.
With the two skills roughly even in ranks, for example, you'd have a roughly %50 chance at using the left hand over the right hand. However, if one were half the ranks of the other, then the chance of using that submissive side would drop to %25 and the dominant hand would raise up to %75. In a situation where you don't have ranks in one of the two, you'd have to use RIGHT/LEFT to gain any experience in that no-ranks skill.
J'Lo, I'm a ranger.. I'd believe anything.....
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
With the two skills roughly even in ranks, for example, you'd have a roughly %50 chance at using the left hand over the right hand. However, if one were half the ranks of the other, then the chance of using that submissive side would drop to %25 and the dominant hand would raise up to %75. In a situation where you don't have ranks in one of the two, you'd have to use RIGHT/LEFT to gain any experience in that no-ranks skill.
J'Lo, I'm a ranger.. I'd believe anything.....
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
>Ever been in any fight and tried to use just one hand? I mean really...<
Yeah. Pretty much all the time. Maybe fencing isn't pure 'fighting' for you, but I sure don't use my offhand ever. It's held behind me, and I definitely use evasion, parry, and medium edge skill (or at least their RL equivalents). ;)
-Z
Yeah. Pretty much all the time. Maybe fencing isn't pure 'fighting' for you, but I sure don't use my offhand ever. It's held behind me, and I definitely use evasion, parry, and medium edge skill (or at least their RL equivalents). ;)
-Z
>Yeah. Pretty much all the time. Maybe fencing isn't pure 'fighting' for you, but I sure don't use my offhand ever. It's held behind me, and I definitely use evasion, parry, and medium edge skill (or at least their RL equivalents). ;)
Given that fencing has become more of a sport than actual, life threatening combat; can it really be used as an example since the rules likely preclude some combat maneuvers?
The Declaration of Independence grants Americans the right to pursue happiness, but if caught, you must return it to the pharmaceutical companies.
Given that fencing has become more of a sport than actual, life threatening combat; can it really be used as an example since the rules likely preclude some combat maneuvers?
The Declaration of Independence grants Americans the right to pursue happiness, but if caught, you must return it to the pharmaceutical companies.
Okay .. enough with the brawling and offhand..The GM's have stated how this is supposed to work. I have let this go on long enough. This is a complaints folder not a conflicts one. This is the last warning. The next argumentative post will be pulled and warnings issued.
Please feel free to contact me (Mod-Ikria@play.net), Senior Board Monitor Annwyl (DR-Annwyl@play.net), or GM Cecco (DR-Cecco@play.net).
"Either write things worth reading,
Or do things worth the writing."
--Benjamin Franklin
Please feel free to contact me (Mod-Ikria@play.net), Senior Board Monitor Annwyl (DR-Annwyl@play.net), or GM Cecco (DR-Cecco@play.net).
"Either write things worth reading,
Or do things worth the writing."
--Benjamin Franklin
Maybe they should fix all the OH exp problems then.
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n142/Sirzason/wmsheet2.jpg
a black panther comes flying into view! it hits the ground, bouncing once before sliding to a stop.
A black panther is stunned!
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n142/Sirzason/wmsheet2.jpg
a black panther comes flying into view! it hits the ground, bouncing once before sliding to a stop.
A black panther is stunned!
>>Maybe they should fix all the OH exp problems then.
What other ones are there?
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
What other ones are there?
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
>>It seems slow to train, compared to other skills. I'm pretty sure that's what he was referring to anyway.
If that is the only issue, then I'm hesitant to call it a bug. As you already know if an attack would normally yield 100 bits of weapon experience as a nice round example, then as an off hand version of that attack the off hand weapon skill will get 70 of those bits and the weapon will get 30. So yes, it will train slower than the same weapon trained normally. There are also quite a few other variables that naturally come into play.
I already had planned some changes to how combat tracks off hand attacks to make it a bit neater behind the scenes so if there are other issues, they should hopefully get fixed during that process.
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
If that is the only issue, then I'm hesitant to call it a bug. As you already know if an attack would normally yield 100 bits of weapon experience as a nice round example, then as an off hand version of that attack the off hand weapon skill will get 70 of those bits and the weapon will get 30. So yes, it will train slower than the same weapon trained normally. There are also quite a few other variables that naturally come into play.
I already had planned some changes to how combat tracks off hand attacks to make it a bit neater behind the scenes so if there are other issues, they should hopefully get fixed during that process.
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
>If that is the only issue, then I'm hesitant to call it a bug. As you already know if an attack would normally yield 100 bits of weapon experience as a nice round example, then as an off hand version of that attack the off hand weapon skill will get 70 of those bits and the weapon will get 30. So yes, it will train slower than the same weapon trained normally.
I'm aware of how the exp is supposed to be awarded, it just never seemed quite right. But I can't even train offhand on my main character since the change, so it doesn't really matter either way.
I'm aware of how the exp is supposed to be awarded, it just never seemed quite right. But I can't even train offhand on my main character since the change, so it doesn't really matter either way.
I was not trying to start a conflict, I was simply making my opinion known. I believe, although perhaps naively that if enough people say that it should be that way, that it will get changed.
If by adding a new feature to a game (IE offhand skill) you uncover an unintended side effect, and it turns out that side effect does not negatively effect the game, but on the contrary causes enjoyment for some of the people playing the game. It should not be called a bug, nor a side effect, but a new unanticipated feature.
How fun is it to roleplay a barbarian who goes screaming into battle wielding a 2handed sword and between chops, punches his opponents in the face with his offhand?
Very much so in my opinion, but again, that is only my opinion, I will let the topic lay dormant for now, but I will bring it up now and then just because I truly hope it gets changed.
Thank you.
If by adding a new feature to a game (IE offhand skill) you uncover an unintended side effect, and it turns out that side effect does not negatively effect the game, but on the contrary causes enjoyment for some of the people playing the game. It should not be called a bug, nor a side effect, but a new unanticipated feature.
How fun is it to roleplay a barbarian who goes screaming into battle wielding a 2handed sword and between chops, punches his opponents in the face with his offhand?
Very much so in my opinion, but again, that is only my opinion, I will let the topic lay dormant for now, but I will bring it up now and then just because I truly hope it gets changed.
Thank you.
>How fun is it to roleplay a barbarian who goes screaming into battle wielding a 2handed sword and between chops, punches his opponents in the face with his offhand?
The thing is, you can do that right now. You just don't learn a special skill. Everyone can naturally punch just as hard with their offhand.
The thing is, you can do that right now. You just don't learn a special skill. Everyone can naturally punch just as hard with their offhand.
>>If by adding a new feature to a game (IE offhand skill) you uncover an unintended side effect, and it turns out that side effect does not negatively effect the game, but on the contrary causes enjoyment for some of the people playing the game. It should not be called a bug, nor a side effect, but a new unanticipated feature.
Thing is, that isn't how it happened. When offhand was first introduced, brawling didn't teach it. Changes I made to combat to enable throwing blades accidently broke what should and should not teach off hand weapon skill. Thus, Bug. It was not intended, nor did it fit in with the design we had laid out for future developement both of brawling and of dual wield/off hand attacks. I fixed said bug, but a later release unrelated accidently used older code and removed my fix. It took me a while to realize exactly what changed and get the time to correct it again. I'm sorry to all that are unhappy with my fixing my mistakes, but this is how it was supposed to be.
>>How fun is it to roleplay a barbarian who goes screaming into battle wielding a 2handed sword and between chops, punches his opponents in the face with his offhand?
>>Very much so in my opinion, but again, that is only my opinion, I will let the topic lay dormant for now, but I will bring it up now and then just because I truly hope it gets changed.
And yet you still CAN do exactly that. The ability to PUNCH LEFT while holding a weapon in your right hand and having your left free has not been removed. The only thing I changed was to correct it so that you cannot learn offhand weapon skill from doing so.
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
Thing is, that isn't how it happened. When offhand was first introduced, brawling didn't teach it. Changes I made to combat to enable throwing blades accidently broke what should and should not teach off hand weapon skill. Thus, Bug. It was not intended, nor did it fit in with the design we had laid out for future developement both of brawling and of dual wield/off hand attacks. I fixed said bug, but a later release unrelated accidently used older code and removed my fix. It took me a while to realize exactly what changed and get the time to correct it again. I'm sorry to all that are unhappy with my fixing my mistakes, but this is how it was supposed to be.
>>How fun is it to roleplay a barbarian who goes screaming into battle wielding a 2handed sword and between chops, punches his opponents in the face with his offhand?
>>Very much so in my opinion, but again, that is only my opinion, I will let the topic lay dormant for now, but I will bring it up now and then just because I truly hope it gets changed.
And yet you still CAN do exactly that. The ability to PUNCH LEFT while holding a weapon in your right hand and having your left free has not been removed. The only thing I changed was to correct it so that you cannot learn offhand weapon skill from doing so.
GM Oolan Jeel
"This island is made mainly of coal and surrounded by fish. Only an organizing genius could produce a shortage of coal and fish at the same time." Aneurin Bevan, May 1945, on World War II rationing and shortages in England.
Confirming that brawling didn't teach offhand when it was first released, though I didn't know what the exact bug was obviously. That's kind of cool. You must have had to play around with combat a bit to get throwing blades t work.
As for offhand brawling, three different GMs have said it wasn't intended to happen at various times. As sad as it is not easily being able to power-train another weapon skill along with along with the 20 other skills I'm training, that's how it is.
Suck it up, remember fondly the free ranks you got (I wish I had gotten 100 more HT when the old log throwing was still around), and move on.
*******
Doctor: Are you Alliance?
Early: Am I lion? Huh. I don't think of myself as a lion. But you might as well have a mighty roar!
As for offhand brawling, three different GMs have said it wasn't intended to happen at various times. As sad as it is not easily being able to power-train another weapon skill along with along with the 20 other skills I'm training, that's how it is.
Suck it up, remember fondly the free ranks you got (I wish I had gotten 100 more HT when the old log throwing was still around), and move on.
*******
Doctor: Are you Alliance?
Early: Am I lion? Huh. I don't think of myself as a lion. But you might as well have a mighty roar!
