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ReplyLooking forward to how this works out. I think it could turn out to be a bit of spice for DR- think of how invasions work- I can see these being like mini-invasions- where one pops up, everyone who is hunting in the area will join in- if they want to.
For me- I think head-splitters- I am hunting away and Daddy Head Splitter shows up- sure I can't take him on by myself- so I am forced to leave my prime hunting space- but I can also put out a call on the gweth- or even go find others and ask them to help me take down Daddy Head Splitter- it could be lots of fun.
I do predict- that someone will complain about how it ruins DR for them.
>>For me- I think head-splitters- I am hunting away and Daddy Head Splitter shows up- sure I can't take him on by myself- so I am forced to leave my prime hunting space- but I can also put out a call on the gweth- or even go find others and ask them to help me take down Daddy Head Splitter- it could be lots of fun. <<
The whole concept is really cool. How great it is in application depends on how often it happens, I guess. We'll see once the novelty wears off.
The whole concept is really cool. How great it is in application depends on how often it happens, I guess. We'll see once the novelty wears off.
I suppose the big question is frequency. I'd like to see 1-2 veteran mobs during a typical hunting trip (let's say an hour?). They need to an ever-present threat to make combat more exciting as intended, IMO. I'd like to see an elite mob once every several hours, and boss mobs should be once-a-day types assuming you're hunting for 24 hours straight (or maybe you see one once a week for a more realistic play schedule).
If bosses only spawn once a week sure, I can see them having custom loots, but if they're just going to be handled server-side and spawn automatically every six hours, I don't think their special equipment should be farmable.
If bosses only spawn once a week sure, I can see them having custom loots, but if they're just going to be handled server-side and spawn automatically every six hours, I don't think their special equipment should be farmable.
>> I suppose the big question is frequency. I'd like to see 1-2 veteran mobs during a typical hunting trip (let's say an hour?). They need to an ever-present threat to make combat more exciting as intended, IMO. I'd like to see an elite mob once every several hours, and boss mobs should be once-a-day types assuming you're hunting for 24 hours straight (or maybe you see one once a week for a more realistic play schedule).
I don't mean to be rude, but that's a fairly insane suggestion. 1-2 veterans per hour? You do realize how much the range of tohit has expanded, yes? I'm fighting a 850 rank creature at 1200+ defenses(1300+ parry) with 100 in all combat-related stats, fully buffed and having to get healed regularly. This is not even counting the range of the critters themselves expanding(I see 'something I'd kill quickly' all the way up to 'solid')
You are talking about critters that stretch up to +50 CIRCLES like 'oh, I could handle that np'. If an elite appears in Intercessors every few hours, who in the hell can even be called to kill it?(A large group is recommended) There's only like 4 people who can even hunt there without getting totally destroyed at this point. 10 people suddenly stepping into a hunting area would mean 30-40 new Intercessors spawning, which I'd assume would be enough to absolutely wreck anyone that shouldn't be there.
IM: Dannyboy00001111
"Fool proof system do not take into account the ingenuity of fools, nor the power of numbers."
I don't mean to be rude, but that's a fairly insane suggestion. 1-2 veterans per hour? You do realize how much the range of tohit has expanded, yes? I'm fighting a 850 rank creature at 1200+ defenses(1300+ parry) with 100 in all combat-related stats, fully buffed and having to get healed regularly. This is not even counting the range of the critters themselves expanding(I see 'something I'd kill quickly' all the way up to 'solid')
You are talking about critters that stretch up to +50 CIRCLES like 'oh, I could handle that np'. If an elite appears in Intercessors every few hours, who in the hell can even be called to kill it?(A large group is recommended) There's only like 4 people who can even hunt there without getting totally destroyed at this point. 10 people suddenly stepping into a hunting area would mean 30-40 new Intercessors spawning, which I'd assume would be enough to absolutely wreck anyone that shouldn't be there.
IM: Dannyboy00001111
"Fool proof system do not take into account the ingenuity of fools, nor the power of numbers."
>>'oh, I could handle that np'
Like a boss.
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
Like a boss.
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
>>I don't mean to be rude, but that's a fairly insane suggestion. 1-2 veterans per hour? You do realize how much the range of tohit has expanded, yes? I'm fighting a 850 rank creature at 1200+ defenses(1300+ parry) with 100 in all combat-related stats, fully buffed and having to get healed regularly. This is not even counting the range of the critters themselves expanding(I see 'something I'd kill quickly' all the way up to 'solid')
Veterans are the tier-one critters he said would be soloable with some difficulty. Yes, I would enjoy seeing about one of those an hour. Basically just a normal critter +.
I don't want to see bosses that require 10-person groups regularly, which is what you seem to think I am suggesting.
Veterans are the tier-one critters he said would be soloable with some difficulty. Yes, I would enjoy seeing about one of those an hour. Basically just a normal critter +.
I don't want to see bosses that require 10-person groups regularly, which is what you seem to think I am suggesting.
I'm just hoping that people who can only game or hunt for an hour here and there get to experience bosses as well.
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
Sounds like an awesome idea. I would love to find ways to encourage group combat.
I'm curious on how the system will decide to spawn a boss.. having one show up in a hunting area at off-hours could pretty much temporarily ruin that hunting area as well as waste a good boss encounter if the people who are there aren't interested.
If critters spawn based on the number of people in a hunting area, maybe bosses could also.
If a group of people are in a hunting area for a certain amount of time (not just running through) then it increases the chance for a boss creature.
Not sure I completely like that idea either.. if the chance it too low, you have a group of players sitting around waiting.. if the chance is too high you can pretty much summon a boss on demand.
The idea of encountering a boss and asking for help sounds cool too..sometimes. There are times I would love for that to happen, and there are times I would probably be annoyed because I have a specific goal in mind and don't want to hunt with others at the moment. If the second case, I can deal with it though. Sound the alarm over gweths so others to enjoy and move to the other side of the hunting ground. Most of the time I would love to be involved though.
I wonder how they'll do it.. have it just randomly occur, or allow people to act in a way to encourage a boss to appear.
Maybe both.. if a group comes in and starts killing the critters, the more they kill the higher the chance that a boss will show up.
It would definitely make things like the mentor sponsored Adan'f and undead hunts more interesting, where hundreds of them are killed and a few bosses might show up to try to fight us off.
I guess another idea could be a somewhat rare trinket that a normal critter randomly drops.. if activated a boss will appear shortly (or if ignored, the janitor will grab it) Up to the person who kills the critter what they want to do... I don't really like that idea either. Sort of breaks the immersion.. and people would pick them up and try to sell them.
Maybe instead of a trinket, there would just be messaging.. you hear something approaching in the distance.. ignore it and nothing happens, react some predefined way and a boss will show up.
Not sure I like the last idea at all..
I'm sure they've already put a lot of thought into it. I can't wait to see how it works.
I'm curious on how the system will decide to spawn a boss.. having one show up in a hunting area at off-hours could pretty much temporarily ruin that hunting area as well as waste a good boss encounter if the people who are there aren't interested.
If critters spawn based on the number of people in a hunting area, maybe bosses could also.
If a group of people are in a hunting area for a certain amount of time (not just running through) then it increases the chance for a boss creature.
Not sure I completely like that idea either.. if the chance it too low, you have a group of players sitting around waiting.. if the chance is too high you can pretty much summon a boss on demand.
The idea of encountering a boss and asking for help sounds cool too..sometimes. There are times I would love for that to happen, and there are times I would probably be annoyed because I have a specific goal in mind and don't want to hunt with others at the moment. If the second case, I can deal with it though. Sound the alarm over gweths so others to enjoy and move to the other side of the hunting ground. Most of the time I would love to be involved though.
I wonder how they'll do it.. have it just randomly occur, or allow people to act in a way to encourage a boss to appear.
Maybe both.. if a group comes in and starts killing the critters, the more they kill the higher the chance that a boss will show up.
It would definitely make things like the mentor sponsored Adan'f and undead hunts more interesting, where hundreds of them are killed and a few bosses might show up to try to fight us off.
I guess another idea could be a somewhat rare trinket that a normal critter randomly drops.. if activated a boss will appear shortly (or if ignored, the janitor will grab it) Up to the person who kills the critter what they want to do... I don't really like that idea either. Sort of breaks the immersion.. and people would pick them up and try to sell them.
Maybe instead of a trinket, there would just be messaging.. you hear something approaching in the distance.. ignore it and nothing happens, react some predefined way and a boss will show up.
Not sure I like the last idea at all..
I'm sure they've already put a lot of thought into it. I can't wait to see how it works.
>> having to get healed regularly.
Alas, I have empaths complaining in another thread that it is impossible to get hurt in combat 3.0!
>> difficulty
Only veterans will spawn with this first release. They should be soloable, just somewhat more difficult (durable) and give better normal loot. Once those are in place, not destroying the game and I have some feedback we can look at the "mini quest" options for groups to spawn harder bosses.
Bosses will generally be very useful for invasions (player made and GM made), quests, group gladiator pits and Lairs. I don't necessarily want them causing soloers to die horribly in the field just because they didn't see the elite heartsmashermauler saunter into the room.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
Alas, I have empaths complaining in another thread that it is impossible to get hurt in combat 3.0!
>> difficulty
Only veterans will spawn with this first release. They should be soloable, just somewhat more difficult (durable) and give better normal loot. Once those are in place, not destroying the game and I have some feedback we can look at the "mini quest" options for groups to spawn harder bosses.
Bosses will generally be very useful for invasions (player made and GM made), quests, group gladiator pits and Lairs. I don't necessarily want them causing soloers to die horribly in the field just because they didn't see the elite heartsmashermauler saunter into the room.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
>>Alas, I have empaths complaining in another thread that it is impossible to get hurt in combat 3.0!
I honestly feel that if low level wounds (levels 1 and 2?) didn't hinder things, there would be less outcry.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
I honestly feel that if low level wounds (levels 1 and 2?) didn't hinder things, there would be less outcry.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
>>I don't mean to be rude, but that's a fairly insane suggestion. 1-2 veterans per hour? You do realize how much the range of tohit has expanded, yes?
It doesn't sound like veteran mobs would be any more difficult than enraged tuskies spawning in stompers/maulers, and those spawn at 1-2 per hour without ruining those hunting grounds
Apu
_
Respect. Integrity. World Domination.
https://sites.google.com/site/apucorpdr/
It doesn't sound like veteran mobs would be any more difficult than enraged tuskies spawning in stompers/maulers, and those spawn at 1-2 per hour without ruining those hunting grounds
Apu
_
Respect. Integrity. World Domination.
https://sites.google.com/site/apucorpdr/
I wonder if a good way to do higher level boss spawn would be through some sort of item mechanic that would be a rare drop from a minion, like a treasure map.
You get an item of some kind that when invoked, will spawn a boss mob after X number of minions have been killed, or after you kill a minion carrying a certain item or something. That would enable a group to get together to hunt the boss mob, but would also have the boss not show up immediately upon invoking the item, thus making it sort of like a mini quest. It could pay out loot like a treasure map, as well, so someone who isn't into group hunting could pass off or sell the boss quest summoning item to someone else.
You get an item of some kind that when invoked, will spawn a boss mob after X number of minions have been killed, or after you kill a minion carrying a certain item or something. That would enable a group to get together to hunt the boss mob, but would also have the boss not show up immediately upon invoking the item, thus making it sort of like a mini quest. It could pay out loot like a treasure map, as well, so someone who isn't into group hunting could pass off or sell the boss quest summoning item to someone else.
>>You get an item of some kind that when invoked, will spawn a boss mob after X number of minions have been killed, or after you kill a minion carrying a certain item or something. That would enable a group to get together to hunt the boss mob, but would also have the boss not show up immediately upon invoking the item, thus making it sort of like a mini quest. It could pay out loot like a treasure map, as well, so someone who isn't into group hunting could pass off or sell the boss quest summoning item to someone else.
This is a neat idea. That sounds like something that would be more for a payed quest mechanic however. I'm hoping elite mobs and bosses eventually become a part of everyday hunting, outside of quest/invasion systems. The only real problem I see with this is just spawning bosses that require a five-person group in the middle of a hunting ground, which might be a bit unfair: even if they don't auto-advance players, can easily see someone accidentally attacking them just as they walk in the room.
Will be interesting to see what they do with bosses. Maybe they could create the DR equivalent of a dungeon or instance by giving most hunting grounds a single room where bosses would appear, so players could avoid that room if they so chose.
This is a neat idea. That sounds like something that would be more for a payed quest mechanic however. I'm hoping elite mobs and bosses eventually become a part of everyday hunting, outside of quest/invasion systems. The only real problem I see with this is just spawning bosses that require a five-person group in the middle of a hunting ground, which might be a bit unfair: even if they don't auto-advance players, can easily see someone accidentally attacking them just as they walk in the room.
Will be interesting to see what they do with bosses. Maybe they could create the DR equivalent of a dungeon or instance by giving most hunting grounds a single room where bosses would appear, so players could avoid that room if they so chose.
> Risen's power is based entirely off the Necro him/herself (plus whatever buffs they apply) so I don't see why not...
That's not entirely true unless something was changed. It was stated that the creature you make a zombie from affects the zombies strength slightly, though much less of a factor than anything else.
That's not entirely true unless something was changed. It was stated that the creature you make a zombie from affects the zombies strength slightly, though much less of a factor than anything else.
>That's not entirely true unless something was changed. It was stated that the creature you make a zombie from affects the zombies strength slightly, though much less of a factor than anything else.
I think this only applies to critters a fair bit beneath you. Though don't quote me on that.
-The Forsaken Rakash
http://elanthipedia.org/w/index.php/Khiol
I think this only applies to critters a fair bit beneath you. Though don't quote me on that.
-The Forsaken Rakash
http://elanthipedia.org/w/index.php/Khiol
>>That's not entirely true unless something was changed. It was stated that the creature you make a zombie from affects the zombies strength slightly, though much less of a factor than anything else.
If it is a factor, it's by far the smallest in my experience. Been a long time since I actively played a Necro to be fair, though I don't think Risen code has changed since release and initial tweaking.
If it is a factor, it's by far the smallest in my experience. Been a long time since I actively played a Necro to be fair, though I don't think Risen code has changed since release and initial tweaking.
>>Zombies
Agreed, it's definitely a nearly invisible factor. Though I have noticed (natural) armor persists at least, slice resistant critters make slice resistant zombies. Even if the benefit is more than we expect, having a slightly B.A. minion for 1-2 hours seems like a nice reward for taking down a boss.
That said, I'm positive I'd be way too greedy for treasure to make a zombie out of a boss. Can't wait to see these in the wild!
- G
Agreed, it's definitely a nearly invisible factor. Though I have noticed (natural) armor persists at least, slice resistant critters make slice resistant zombies. Even if the benefit is more than we expect, having a slightly B.A. minion for 1-2 hours seems like a nice reward for taking down a boss.
That said, I'm positive I'd be way too greedy for treasure to make a zombie out of a boss. Can't wait to see these in the wild!
- G
>Zombies
It's completely curiosity. I'm not really in favor of one way or the other.
I could see a high level Necromancer laying in wait for that group of players to take down the boss and throwing a wrench into the whole plan. Fun? Not fun? Again, just curious.
You're going to get a bad reputation if you go around pinching every spectral reaper you see.
It's completely curiosity. I'm not really in favor of one way or the other.
I could see a high level Necromancer laying in wait for that group of players to take down the boss and throwing a wrench into the whole plan. Fun? Not fun? Again, just curious.
You're going to get a bad reputation if you go around pinching every spectral reaper you see.
Not crazy about the boss idea. Keep it for paid quests. I don't want to have to move from hunting because a boss shows up (even if it is a rare, odd chance), or even worse, unable to retreat from a boss I can't fight alone. IMO, this idea of bosses is just trying to force a concept of group hunting, which I've never been a big fan of. I'm not against group hunting, but I prefer to hunt alone. Bosses could/would ruin it. I think a rethink is in order for this idea.
>>I don't want to have to move from hunting because a boss shows up (even if it is a rare, odd chance), or even worse, unable to retreat from a boss I can't fight alone.
The plan is for neither of those to occur. Veterans, the base level of boss that you'll encounter in the wild will not be much harder than a normal creature. They'll take longer to kill and generally get in an extra hit or two, but they won't be any harder to hit. The retreat penalty from being engaged with just one of these is minor.
Other mechanics will have to be activated for the harder bosses to spawn, and for the group-requirement to kick in.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
The plan is for neither of those to occur. Veterans, the base level of boss that you'll encounter in the wild will not be much harder than a normal creature. They'll take longer to kill and generally get in an extra hit or two, but they won't be any harder to hit. The retreat penalty from being engaged with just one of these is minor.
Other mechanics will have to be activated for the harder bosses to spawn, and for the group-requirement to kick in.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
>>Group Hunt Bosses
Out of curiously, what makes it so that you have to have a group for the heavier types? Vitality regen is faster than one person can do damage? Could I hunt a lower level group-required-boss and learn weapons for 12 hours straight without killing it? Heh.
Codiax.
Forged Weapons:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Codiax#Codiax-Forged-Weapons
Out of curiously, what makes it so that you have to have a group for the heavier types? Vitality regen is faster than one person can do damage? Could I hunt a lower level group-required-boss and learn weapons for 12 hours straight without killing it? Heh.
Codiax.
Forged Weapons:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Codiax#Codiax-Forged-Weapons
>>Out of curiously, what makes it so that you have to have a group for the heavier types?
They'd regen faster than you could kill them, and they have a minimum to-hit high enough to kill you before you'd learn well off them. Bosses will also have special bonuses that will require a group maintaining tactical debuffs to overcome. For example, immunity to CC, impervious armor and perfect balance - each removed by the corresponding combo debuff.
Those particular attributes will only exist on champions and above. The veterans are ready but I'll probably give it another week to tweak some things. Had a lore itch I'm trying to scratch by finishing some things up.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
They'd regen faster than you could kill them, and they have a minimum to-hit high enough to kill you before you'd learn well off them. Bosses will also have special bonuses that will require a group maintaining tactical debuffs to overcome. For example, immunity to CC, impervious armor and perfect balance - each removed by the corresponding combo debuff.
Those particular attributes will only exist on champions and above. The veterans are ready but I'll probably give it another week to tweak some things. Had a lore itch I'm trying to scratch by finishing some things up.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
Thanks for the explanation Kodius - neat!
Codiax.
Forged Weapons:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Codiax#Codiax-Forged-Weapons
Codiax.
Forged Weapons:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Codiax#Codiax-Forged-Weapons
While the discussion on bosses is still working, what about adding a very increased(or gaurenteed?) chance of spell scrolls with veteran+ level mobs? This would help alleviate some of the issues with the sorcery skill (and people wanting to avoid pvp, tournaments, invasions because they don't want to lose their invoked scrolls).
Quite frustrating last night when a critter well below my ranks one-shot me with their special attack during an invasion.
>>Anyone care to share if they've found any of these so far, or better yet, which creatures they've found have this system turned on? I'd love to see how it is.
They're not active yet. Last ETA Kodius gave was sometime this week, though that is of course just an estimate and not a commitment.
They're not active yet. Last ETA Kodius gave was sometime this week, though that is of course just an estimate and not a commitment.
* A meteor streaks across the sky as a veteran alley thug's soul departs forever to walk the Starry Road.
This messaging is, oh wait...
Veteran alley thug, maybe they were doing a spot of testing again, or a limited release.
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
This messaging is, oh wait...
Veteran alley thug, maybe they were doing a spot of testing again, or a limited release.
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
>* A meteor streaks across the sky as a veteran alley thug's soul departs forever to walk the Starry Road.
That was me. Some thuggish types got uppity in my forge so I had to put them down.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
That was me. Some thuggish types got uppity in my forge so I had to put them down.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
>>* A meteor streaks across the sky as a veteran alley thug's soul departs forever to walk the Starry Road.
The thugs always have a random modifier in front of them, usually racial, but sometimes descriptive. IIRC veteran is one possible permutation, probably just coincidence. Though it could have been an elite mob.
The thugs always have a random modifier in front of them, usually racial, but sometimes descriptive. IIRC veteran is one possible permutation, probably just coincidence. Though it could have been an elite mob.
>The thugs always have a random modifier in front of them, usually racial, but sometimes descriptive. IIRC veteran is one possible permutation, probably just coincidence. Though it could have been an elite mob.
I wasn't joking. There were some thugs and footpads that came into the Crossing forge and I smashed them. A couple were veteran and there was a champion? assassin I also swatted.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
I wasn't joking. There were some thugs and footpads that came into the Crossing forge and I smashed them. A couple were veteran and there was a champion? assassin I also swatted.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
just an idea for loot on the boss or champion type critters. maybe have boss types drop a specific part like a tooth or eyeball style "proof of kill" each member of the party automatically gets one on the boss' death. then you take the proof to a local town hall or maybe even a guard house where you turn it in for a random sack of good stuff.
this would tone down on people ninjaing loot from boss drops. the sack could have random stuff in it based off of the treasure system or a special one for boss critters.
this would tone down on people ninjaing loot from boss drops. the sack could have random stuff in it based off of the treasure system or a special one for boss critters.
