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Seer's Sense - Fixed a bunch of bugs here. Casting on others will no longer interfere with casting on yourself, you can now properly sense spells being prepped and spells on someone you're linked to (This feature has always been there but never worked before due to a very very old math error). Some other general clean up.
Tangled Fate - Should behave more robustly when removed early. If Tangled Fate goes, the prediction should go with it.
Sovereign Destiny - Will now check if the target is being monitored by a Seer's Sense link and shred that. Increased to 3 spell slots. (Yes, these changes are unrelated.)
Tezirah's Veil - Very significant overhaul of how it handles creature debuffs plus some restructuring of the rest of the code which should be invisible. Aside from no longer absurdly breaking creatures when repeatedly applied you should see little change here.
Perc Teleological - Updated this to give a more accurate reading (I forgot to update it when I redid the mana calculations) and added the ability to sense if you're under the effects of teleologic corruption.
Tweaks Yet To Come (Maybe Tomorrow, Possibly):
Integration of Astrology into Teleologic Sorcery.
Predict Analyze on critters (For the sake of Tezirah's Veil).
Justice tweaks wrt Sorcery and Forbidden Practices.
Things that will make Malzard smile (This is a little longer time line than the rest).
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
>teleologic corruption.
What's this?
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
What's this?
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
>>Tezirah's Veil - Very significant overhaul of how it handles creature debuffs plus some restructuring of the rest of the code which should be invisible. Aside from no longer absurdly breaking creatures when repeatedly applied you should see little change here.
Can you please be more specific about these changes? Will the spell no longer stack predictions even if cast multiple times?
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
Can you please be more specific about these changes? Will the spell no longer stack predictions even if cast multiple times?
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
>>Sovereign Destiny - Will now check if the target is being monitored by a Seer's Sense link and shred that. Increased to 3 spell slots. (Yes, these changes are unrelated.)
If Sovereign Destiny is using only 3 slots can you explain the justification of making Mental Blast a 4 slot spell?
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
>>If Sovereign Destiny is using only 3 slots can you explain the justification of making Mental Blast a 4 slot spell?
It's an apples and oranges comparison, but SOD is rather focused in what it does (kill off certain MM spells, block predictions, minor mentals debuff), while MD can disarm, stun, and incapacitate.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
It's an apples and oranges comparison, but SOD is rather focused in what it does (kill off certain MM spells, block predictions, minor mentals debuff), while MD can disarm, stun, and incapacitate.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
>>teleologic corruption.
Honestly, I used the wrong words there. It's the spellbook lockout thing. Teleologic corruption is something entirely diff... oh, wait, I'm not going to talk about that yet.
This: Traces of prior sorcery still cling to your essence though even these should fade within 14 seconds.
>>I'm playing with these platside. No free ranks. With 52 ranks <so far> of sorcery, i've managed to cast TV and SOD so far, still no luck with Sever thread or Tangled fate.
That's... interesting, and I see why. TV and SOD should be harder to cast and right now they are... on the high end. They are, however, easier to cast on the low end. This is one of those tweaks I was talking about we need to make.
>>Can you please be more specific about these changes? Will the spell no longer stack predictions even if cast multiple times?
It was never intended to stack predictions, if it happens to repeat a prediction on a creature it will replace instead of stack. They don't merge both due to technical reasons and you're likely better off with the new prediction than the old unless you're wildly varying mana between casts. Letting it stack can do horrible awful no good very bad things (Like drive a creature's ability to parry negative).
>>If Sovereign Destiny is using only 3 slots can you explain the justification of making Mental Blast a 4 slot spell?
MB = Disable + Nerve Damage + Prone + Drop items = 4 slots.
(For comparison Sleep = Disable + Prone = 2 slots)
SoV = (Debuffs Int + Debuffs Wis + Debuffs Disc) / 2 (they're half power) = 1.5
+ (Dispels spells + Dispels predictions + Locks out future spells) / 2 (It only does to one guild) = 1.5
The math isn't actually quite that clean, but if SOD did the sort of things it does to everyone and not just Moon Mages it would be an easy 4 slotter. A better way might to think of it as "If the Moon Mage stuff was gone, as a stat debuff alone it'd be 2 slots, all the moon mage stuff is an extra slot".
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
Honestly, I used the wrong words there. It's the spellbook lockout thing. Teleologic corruption is something entirely diff... oh, wait, I'm not going to talk about that yet.
This: Traces of prior sorcery still cling to your essence though even these should fade within 14 seconds.
>>I'm playing with these platside. No free ranks. With 52 ranks <so far> of sorcery, i've managed to cast TV and SOD so far, still no luck with Sever thread or Tangled fate.
That's... interesting, and I see why. TV and SOD should be harder to cast and right now they are... on the high end. They are, however, easier to cast on the low end. This is one of those tweaks I was talking about we need to make.
>>Can you please be more specific about these changes? Will the spell no longer stack predictions even if cast multiple times?
It was never intended to stack predictions, if it happens to repeat a prediction on a creature it will replace instead of stack. They don't merge both due to technical reasons and you're likely better off with the new prediction than the old unless you're wildly varying mana between casts. Letting it stack can do horrible awful no good very bad things (Like drive a creature's ability to parry negative).
>>If Sovereign Destiny is using only 3 slots can you explain the justification of making Mental Blast a 4 slot spell?
MB = Disable + Nerve Damage + Prone + Drop items = 4 slots.
(For comparison Sleep = Disable + Prone = 2 slots)
SoV = (Debuffs Int + Debuffs Wis + Debuffs Disc) / 2 (they're half power) = 1.5
+ (Dispels spells + Dispels predictions + Locks out future spells) / 2 (It only does to one guild) = 1.5
The math isn't actually quite that clean, but if SOD did the sort of things it does to everyone and not just Moon Mages it would be an easy 4 slotter. A better way might to think of it as "If the Moon Mage stuff was gone, as a stat debuff alone it'd be 2 slots, all the moon mage stuff is an extra slot".
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
>>It was never intended to stack predictions, if it happens to repeat a prediction on a creature it will replace instead of stack. They don't merge both due to technical reasons and you're likely better off with the new prediction than the old unless you're wildly varying mana between casts. Letting it stack can do horrible awful no good very bad things (Like drive a creature's ability to parry negative).
Awesome thanks for the info
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
A post has been hidden. I wasn't kidding about the personal attacks.
The 3.0 forums have been extremely successful so far in helping us rapidly address bugs, problems, concerns and so forth - Let's not spoil that.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
The 3.0 forums have been extremely successful so far in helping us rapidly address bugs, problems, concerns and so forth - Let's not spoil that.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
>>The math isn't actually quite that clean, but if SOD did the sort of things it does to everyone and not just Moon Mages it would be an easy 4 slotter. A better way might to think of it as "If the Moon Mage stuff was gone, as a stat debuff alone it'd be 2 slots, all the moon mage stuff is an extra slot".
This is an understatement.
3 slots for SOD = 3 stat debuff + Dispels spells from 2 books + dispels Seers Link + Dispels Seers Sense Buff + Locks out casting 2 spell books + Dispels Predictions + Locks out Predictions + Fills Prediction Pools
Mental Blast is being over glorified by your little equation also. Adding prone as an effect that is just a side effect of SLEEP which is hardly the spells main function. And on this subject. Does the guild really need to have 2 sleep spells?
I highly suggest either raising the slot cost on SOD to actually make some darn sense or lower the spell slot requirement of Mental Blast.
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
This is an understatement.
3 slots for SOD = 3 stat debuff + Dispels spells from 2 books + dispels Seers Link + Dispels Seers Sense Buff + Locks out casting 2 spell books + Dispels Predictions + Locks out Predictions + Fills Prediction Pools
Mental Blast is being over glorified by your little equation also. Adding prone as an effect that is just a side effect of SLEEP which is hardly the spells main function. And on this subject. Does the guild really need to have 2 sleep spells?
I highly suggest either raising the slot cost on SOD to actually make some darn sense or lower the spell slot requirement of Mental Blast.
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
>>Fills Prediction Pools
You got TV in your SoD. Keep in mind that the stat debuffs aren't as robust as singular/dual stat debuffs. If a normal stat debuff is a single -10 (random example), SoD is more like -2 or -3 in each.
>>Mental Blast is being over glorified by your little equation also. Adding prone as an effect that is just a side effect of SLEEP which is hardly the spells main function. And on this subject. Does the guild really need to have 2 sleep spells?
Stun + Nerve Damage + Dropping Stuff + Sleep/Prone seems pretty 4 slot to me.
Look at it this way.
Dazzle is a 1 slot stunner.
Stun Foe is 1 slot stunner.
Thunderclap is a 2 slot AoE stunner (1 part stun, 1 part AoE).
Based on this, it's safe to say stun is worth a slot.
I think it's also safe to say that the sleep state is worth at least 1 slot also, since the Sleep spell costs 2.
Nissa's Binding also costs 2, so if we go by AoE always making things go up a slot, then like TC it's AoE + 1 slot for the whole sleeping thing. Guess this means NB should cost 3 or Sleep should cost 1, who knows!
I also think we can all agree that dropping held gear is worth a slot. Shutting off one, if not two, defensive stances temporarily should be worth at least 1 slot, right?
So now we're down to nerve damage. I don't think it's unreasonable that nerve damage is worth 1 slot.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
You got TV in your SoD. Keep in mind that the stat debuffs aren't as robust as singular/dual stat debuffs. If a normal stat debuff is a single -10 (random example), SoD is more like -2 or -3 in each.
>>Mental Blast is being over glorified by your little equation also. Adding prone as an effect that is just a side effect of SLEEP which is hardly the spells main function. And on this subject. Does the guild really need to have 2 sleep spells?
Stun + Nerve Damage + Dropping Stuff + Sleep/Prone seems pretty 4 slot to me.
Look at it this way.
Dazzle is a 1 slot stunner.
Stun Foe is 1 slot stunner.
Thunderclap is a 2 slot AoE stunner (1 part stun, 1 part AoE).
Based on this, it's safe to say stun is worth a slot.
I think it's also safe to say that the sleep state is worth at least 1 slot also, since the Sleep spell costs 2.
Nissa's Binding also costs 2, so if we go by AoE always making things go up a slot, then like TC it's AoE + 1 slot for the whole sleeping thing. Guess this means NB should cost 3 or Sleep should cost 1, who knows!
I also think we can all agree that dropping held gear is worth a slot. Shutting off one, if not two, defensive stances temporarily should be worth at least 1 slot, right?
So now we're down to nerve damage. I don't think it's unreasonable that nerve damage is worth 1 slot.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
>>Look at it this way.
Good logic. I like this post. Now what do you think about SOD remaining a 3 slot spell? And how do you feel about Mental Blast losing its sleep effect and becoming more in line to make a target drop his weapons and take nerve damage?
Since we already have the Sleep Spell and since the sleep effect of MB is only going to work in PVE effectively, I feel we should move away from the sleep effect of MB if its going to take up more spell slots. Anyone who has tested MB in 3.0 knows its main function is short stun, nerve damage and making them drop weapons. Sleep is not reliable for MB in its current state in 3.0
I would much rather remove the sleep effect from MB or remove the sleep spell. Our guild would benefit from a Blind or Silence spell more than having 2 sleep spells. And one of those is only going to cause sleep if the target you cast on is well below your skill and stats.
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
>>Now what do you think about SOD remaining a 3 slot spell?
I think SoD is fine as a 3 slot. Its major functions are extremely specific, which probably factors into why it's 3 instead of 4.
>>And how do you feel about Mental Blast losing its sleep effect and becoming more in line to make a target drop his weapons and take nerve damage?
I think it's silly to ask for a spell to do less because another spell covers some of the functionality. If you feel that MB makes sleep redundant, then just don't get sleep. That'll make up the difference in spell slots for you.
>>I would much rather remove the sleep effect from MB or remove the sleep spell.
The best thing about 3.0 is that there's rarely a need to get a spell if you dislike it. Just don't get sleep if you feel it doesn't do enough in comparison to Mind Blast.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
I think SoD is fine as a 3 slot. Its major functions are extremely specific, which probably factors into why it's 3 instead of 4.
>>And how do you feel about Mental Blast losing its sleep effect and becoming more in line to make a target drop his weapons and take nerve damage?
I think it's silly to ask for a spell to do less because another spell covers some of the functionality. If you feel that MB makes sleep redundant, then just don't get sleep. That'll make up the difference in spell slots for you.
>>I would much rather remove the sleep effect from MB or remove the sleep spell.
The best thing about 3.0 is that there's rarely a need to get a spell if you dislike it. Just don't get sleep if you feel it doesn't do enough in comparison to Mind Blast.
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
>>I think it's silly to ask for a spell to do less because another spell covers some of the functionality. If you feel that MB makes sleep redundant, then just don't get sleep. That'll make up the difference in spell slots for you.
This is just not right. Having multiple spells doing the same thing filling the spell book is wasteful and against the overall goals for 3.0 to make things less redundant.
Have you tested MB and Sleep in PVP and PVE yet? MB is not reliable at sleeping something and is basically a niche effect for back training or hunting something that does not pose a challenge. I can't even sleep critters where I hunt with at all in 3.0 with MB. And in 2.0 I can snap cast a min prep MB and sleep the same critters.
>>I think SoD is fine as a 3 slot. Its major functions are extremely specific, which probably factors into why it's 3 instead of 4.
But technically its major function is still doing far more than any other spell I can think of. That is just in plain number of effects. You can't bundle everything it does to moon mages as a single effect. We should make more spells that have a snowball of effects bundled into 1 slot if that is the case for SOD. Sleep and Prone are CERTAINLY able to be bundled using that same logic.
And yet we have MB that is not even capable of sleeping a target that is not insanely weak. It is using the sleep effect to justify making it the HIGHEST costing spell in our book and it is hardly reliable in any sense when it comes to sleeping.
MB should do nerve damage, make them drop weapons and cause a stun. We have sleep already. IF you want something to sleep it would make NO sense at all to use MB over sleep for this purpose.
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
This is just not right. Having multiple spells doing the same thing filling the spell book is wasteful and against the overall goals for 3.0 to make things less redundant.
Have you tested MB and Sleep in PVP and PVE yet? MB is not reliable at sleeping something and is basically a niche effect for back training or hunting something that does not pose a challenge. I can't even sleep critters where I hunt with at all in 3.0 with MB. And in 2.0 I can snap cast a min prep MB and sleep the same critters.
>>I think SoD is fine as a 3 slot. Its major functions are extremely specific, which probably factors into why it's 3 instead of 4.
But technically its major function is still doing far more than any other spell I can think of. That is just in plain number of effects. You can't bundle everything it does to moon mages as a single effect. We should make more spells that have a snowball of effects bundled into 1 slot if that is the case for SOD. Sleep and Prone are CERTAINLY able to be bundled using that same logic.
And yet we have MB that is not even capable of sleeping a target that is not insanely weak. It is using the sleep effect to justify making it the HIGHEST costing spell in our book and it is hardly reliable in any sense when it comes to sleeping.
MB should do nerve damage, make them drop weapons and cause a stun. We have sleep already. IF you want something to sleep it would make NO sense at all to use MB over sleep for this purpose.
In reality as in dreams, nothing is quite as it seems.
>>MB is not reliable at sleeping something and is basically a niche effect for back training or hunting something that does not pose a challenge.
Seems it would have some pretty awesome group combat capability. Just wait for a Barbarian to stun someone with a weapon attack and pop off a cast of MB on that target to achieve sleep + nerve damage + whatever else MB does.
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
Seems it would have some pretty awesome group combat capability. Just wait for a Barbarian to stun someone with a weapon attack and pop off a cast of MB on that target to achieve sleep + nerve damage + whatever else MB does.
~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
>> And yet we have MB that is not even capable of sleeping a target that is not insanely weak. It is using the sleep effect to justify making it the HIGHEST costing spell in our book and it is hardly reliable in any sense when it comes to sleeping.
I've been able to do it just fine, and thats with less mentals than I should for my level since I'm sitting on 2k tdps in prime and even more in test. Also prydaen so I'm not very good at training those stats.
_______________________
It is impossible to strive for the heroic life. The title of hero is bestowed by the survivors upon the fallen, who themselves know nothing of heroism.
-Johan Huizinga
The Light is Crimson through the Darkness.
Ive been doing ok on it as well. A quick double cast and they drop for a rather long time. I havent been pumping in tons of mana to test the instant sleep part. But one to stun/drop items/damage and a second to sleep/more damage has worked just dandy for me.
~Tezirite Renzar Lorrani
"Power is merely a stepping stone to more power."
~Tezirite Renzar Lorrani
"Power is merely a stepping stone to more power."
>>Ive been doing ok on it as well. A quick double cast and they drop for a rather long time. I havent been pumping in tons of mana to test the instant sleep part. But one to stun/drop items/damage and a second to sleep/more damage has worked just dandy for me.
Its been changed so there's no instant sleep. A successful cast on an undisabled target always produces a stun, a successful cast on a stunned target (regardless of the origin of the stun) always produces a sleep.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
Its been changed so there's no instant sleep. A successful cast on an undisabled target always produces a stun, a successful cast on a stunned target (regardless of the origin of the stun) always produces a sleep.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
>> Its been changed so there's no instant sleep. A successful cast on an undisabled target always produces a stun, a successful cast on a stunned target (regardless of the origin of the stun) always produces a sleep.
One of my favorite parts of combat is weaving magic and melee. High % stun weapons for Moonies could make MB a lot more efficient. (Not that casting twice is terribly inefficient.)
One of my favorite parts of combat is weaving magic and melee. High % stun weapons for Moonies could make MB a lot more efficient. (Not that casting twice is terribly inefficient.)
