When, oh when will I be able to perceive NPCs? Being a newb Empath in TF really really really bites...
I'm gettin other Empaths but not all the time with 24 empathy, 27 PP. Can give other relavent skills if necessary.
I want it to fly!!!! Fly like the wind! whoosh
When is Wayne Brady gonna get to fly??
~Brady, player of I'm a Lover Not a Fighter Elavin Rismel.
You tap a pair of leather pants with a grey and a navy blue handkerchief stuffed in the right pocket that you are wearing.
~~~
Join The Fallen!
Perceive Health on 10/10/2005 12:20 PM CDT
Re: Perceive Health on 10/10/2005 02:41 PM CDT
Re: Perceive Health on 10/10/2005 03:29 PM CDT
80 empathy
70 PP
I see non-empath PC/NPCs around half the time, closer to 75%+ if I'm relatively wound free.
Thrall of Dergati,
Heroiklim Zortal
Cast of iron, dull grey and pitted, this altar is cold and lifeless. A thin coating of rust covers its surface. The words "Even Death We Master" are scrawled across the altar, defacing even destruction.
70 PP
I see non-empath PC/NPCs around half the time, closer to 75%+ if I'm relatively wound free.
Thrall of Dergati,
Heroiklim Zortal
Cast of iron, dull grey and pitted, this altar is cold and lifeless. A thin coating of rust covers its surface. The words "Even Death We Master" are scrawled across the altar, defacing even destruction.
Re: Perceive Health on 10/11/2005 09:20 PM CDT
Speaking of which... I just perceived three rooms away for the first time!
>You sense:
> The presence of Plake, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Katjia, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Sophrona, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of a scrawny newsboy.
>You sense (SE) from your current position:
> The presence of a young alchemist student.
>You sense (SW) from your current position:
> The presence of a street urchin.
>You sense (SW, W, W) from your current position:
> The presence of Sixtoes, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Rugbyin, a fellow Empath.
>Empathy: 340 31.60% learning
Woot!
>You sense:
> The presence of Plake, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Katjia, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Sophrona, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of a scrawny newsboy.
>You sense (SE) from your current position:
> The presence of a young alchemist student.
>You sense (SW) from your current position:
> The presence of a street urchin.
>You sense (SW, W, W) from your current position:
> The presence of Sixtoes, a fellow Empath.
> The presence of Rugbyin, a fellow Empath.
>Empathy: 340 31.60% learning
Woot!
Perceive Health Breakthrough II on 12/09/2005 10:58 PM CST
I was sitting in the guild, and perceived health, and saw the room to the east! First time it has happened, so I thought I would post the pertinent skills, just to see if this is the change between one room and two:
Empathy: 122
PP: 69
And the latest big change
Overall Lore: 402
I think it might be overall lore, that was the first PH I did after getting to 400 overall. I haven't done it again, but I must be close!
-Davidovf
Empathy: 122
PP: 69
And the latest big change
Overall Lore: 402
I think it might be overall lore, that was the first PH I did after getting to 400 overall. I haven't done it again, but I must be close!
-Davidovf
Re: Perceive Health Breakthrough II on 12/09/2005 11:55 PM CST
I know Symphaena doesn't have near the lore average/overall that Davidovf does, so I'm going to stick to the claim that it's 200 combined ranks of empathy and power perception. Symphaena's got a total of 230ish, and as long as she's on a lucky streak and relatively woundless she sees all in other rooms fairly regularly.
J'Lo, no that other one
J'Lo, no that other one
Re: Perceive Health Breakthrough II on 12/10/2005 12:37 AM CST
Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 03:57 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 06:35 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 06:53 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 09:40 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 02:49 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 03:47 PM CST
Technically speaking, the ability's available right off the bat as soon as you join. You apparently need either at least 20 ranks in at least Empathy if not also PP, or at least a combination of the two approaching 40 ranks. "Occasional success" is not going to be in your Perc Health vocabulary until much later, however, so don't be expecting to lock with it until at least 10-15th and probably much later.
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
J'Lo, no that other one
The Manipulation List -- http://symphaena.com/index.html
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 04:19 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 09:07 PM CST
Yea it only takes a tiny bit of patience and persistance to lock it. I locked it easy several times. And actually looking on it now, I think it should have been set much much higher - should be something of a luxury for more experienced empaths and not those of low circles.. I'm talking any empath below .. say.. circle 30? Maybe higher? Considering I'm locking it so easy I could gain in circles quickly now without actually healing anybody... and that doesn't sound natural for a 4th circler. IMO.
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 10:41 PM CST
Training by perc health at your level is something you'll regret in the long run. Healing spells are some of the best magic teachers ig.
~Arwinia
You are Shrimpstar, a Prydaen Bard.
You have pointed ears and cat-slitted clear colored eyes. Your amber mane is short and thick, and is worn tousled. You have grey fur and a slender tail.
You look tired.
You are wearing nothing special.
~Arwinia
You are Shrimpstar, a Prydaen Bard.
You have pointed ears and cat-slitted clear colored eyes. Your amber mane is short and thick, and is worn tousled. You have grey fur and a slender tail.
You look tired.
You are wearing nothing special.
Re: Perceive Health on 02/22/2007 11:19 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/23/2007 07:17 AM CST
Right now I only use perceive health to keep empathy locked during periods when I'm healing up, and I don't think I'd use it just to gain empathy anyway - there IS value in interaction.
You know in a way perceive health does help.. heh, got snobbed by someone I healed for no reason a couple weeks ago, didn't like an empath who was being kind.. and the first thing that came to mind afterwards is 'you know, I really didn't have to heal you'.. for the simple reason I could've just used perceive health to get what I got from the job in the first place.
You know in a way perceive health does help.. heh, got snobbed by someone I healed for no reason a couple weeks ago, didn't like an empath who was being kind.. and the first thing that came to mind afterwards is 'you know, I really didn't have to heal you'.. for the simple reason I could've just used perceive health to get what I got from the job in the first place.
Re: Perceive Health on 02/23/2007 08:21 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/23/2007 10:57 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 02/23/2007 06:41 PM CST
<Its not a circle based thing, I think it works off of PP. 60 ranks to start?>
you're mostly correct. it's based off empathy AND pp skill. VERY approximately 50 ranks each and you can start detecting fellow empaths and as you work towards 150 ranks each you will start detecting npcs and non empaths. at about 150 you will start getting adjacent rooms and every 100 ranks or so, you can detect another room away starting with fellow empaths, npcs, and other players per room.
pp determines how far away you can detect, empathy determines WHAT you can detect (or so it seems to me). note the disclaimer (or so it seems to me).
Druid Wheller Herbmaster, Con Artist of Elanthia
http://robertdell.dyndns.org/DR_Scripts/
click YASSE.dmg
http://sourceforge.net/projects/yasse/
P.S. no good deed goes un-punished!
When in doubt, reinvent the wheel!
you're mostly correct. it's based off empathy AND pp skill. VERY approximately 50 ranks each and you can start detecting fellow empaths and as you work towards 150 ranks each you will start detecting npcs and non empaths. at about 150 you will start getting adjacent rooms and every 100 ranks or so, you can detect another room away starting with fellow empaths, npcs, and other players per room.
pp determines how far away you can detect, empathy determines WHAT you can detect (or so it seems to me). note the disclaimer (or so it seems to me).
Druid Wheller Herbmaster, Con Artist of Elanthia
http://robertdell.dyndns.org/DR_Scripts/
click YASSE.dmg
http://sourceforge.net/projects/yasse/
P.S. no good deed goes un-punished!
When in doubt, reinvent the wheel!
Re: Perceive Health on 03/01/2007 03:14 AM CST
Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:01 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:09 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:11 PM CST
Power Perception also matters. There's data on Elanthipedia, but my personal experiences were:
Empath, Same Room: ~50 PP / Empathy
Non-Empath, Same Room: Started sporradically at 65ish, but needed 100 to get it consistently. (Empathy and PP)
This was the same for me for non-Empaths, shopkeepers, creatures, and what have you.
Empath, Next Room: ~ 125 (Empathy and PP)
Non-Empath, Next Room: 150-175 (Empathy and PP)
I've started sensing fellow Empaths 2 rooms away at 200 Empathy. Possible I could do it before and only just started noticing it recently. I wish I'd kept better notes, but I'm almost positive that you need about 100 empathy to consistently sense non-Empaths in the same room.
-- Player of Szrael --
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 294 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
Empath, Same Room: ~50 PP / Empathy
Non-Empath, Same Room: Started sporradically at 65ish, but needed 100 to get it consistently. (Empathy and PP)
This was the same for me for non-Empaths, shopkeepers, creatures, and what have you.
Empath, Next Room: ~ 125 (Empathy and PP)
Non-Empath, Next Room: 150-175 (Empathy and PP)
I've started sensing fellow Empaths 2 rooms away at 200 Empathy. Possible I could do it before and only just started noticing it recently. I wish I'd kept better notes, but I'm almost positive that you need about 100 empathy to consistently sense non-Empaths in the same room.
-- Player of Szrael --
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 294 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:16 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:21 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 01:21 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 04:04 PM CST
>>When does Perceive Health start working for me? I've only about 65 in empathy. Do other skills count in my ability to learn empathy from perceive health?
Because of a recent discussion on the plat boards by the player of Asbhuan/Ashbuan/etc (table said he should see FeatX but his empath character wasn't seeing it yet), I started up a second test empath to travel the empathy-only aspect and I found I only needed roughly half the amount as listed on Elanthipedia. Here's the new table with only my own data included:
1)the 25/50/100/etc that starts out each cell is the number of ranks in that one skill (ie, "50 - empathy" = "50 PP ranks - empathy ranks", so with 4 ranks of empathy you effectively only need 46 ranks of PP)
2)Empath 1 saw Feat1 at the 46 PP/4 empathy mark, Feat2 at the 96 PP/4 empathy mark (due to procedural mistakes, empathy ranks increased but the relationship stayed the same throughout all testing)
3)Empath 2 saw Feat1 at the 2 PP/21 empathy mark, hasn't seen Feat2 yet
4)No other empath rank numbers have been processed yet, though everything beyond these two feats is based on nothing but other-player empath rank numbers as posted by their respective players on play.net forums (as in, posted in earlier discussions about Perceive Health)
DISCLAIMER: THIS POSTER IS NOT A MEMBER OF STAFF AND HIS INFORMATION IS/MIGHT BE WRONG.
Because of a recent discussion on the plat boards by the player of Asbhuan/Ashbuan/etc (table said he should see FeatX but his empath character wasn't seeing it yet), I started up a second test empath to travel the empathy-only aspect and I found I only needed roughly half the amount as listed on Elanthipedia. Here's the new table with only my own data included:
feat* | *PP* | *empathy |
empath same room | 50 - empathy | 25 - (PP * 2) |
non-empath same room | 100 - empathy | test not complete (I'm assuming 50 - (PP * 2)) |
1)the 25/50/100/etc that starts out each cell is the number of ranks in that one skill (ie, "50 - empathy" = "50 PP ranks - empathy ranks", so with 4 ranks of empathy you effectively only need 46 ranks of PP)
2)Empath 1 saw Feat1 at the 46 PP/4 empathy mark, Feat2 at the 96 PP/4 empathy mark (due to procedural mistakes, empathy ranks increased but the relationship stayed the same throughout all testing)
3)Empath 2 saw Feat1 at the 2 PP/21 empathy mark, hasn't seen Feat2 yet
4)No other empath rank numbers have been processed yet, though everything beyond these two feats is based on nothing but other-player empath rank numbers as posted by their respective players on play.net forums (as in, posted in earlier discussions about Perceive Health)
DISCLAIMER: THIS POSTER IS NOT A MEMBER OF STAFF AND HIS INFORMATION IS/MIGHT BE WRONG.
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 04:23 PM CST
Data points from 3 of my Plat Empaths.
E1: 33 Empathy/32 PP sees PC Empaths
E2: 14 Empathy/25 PP sees nothing
E3: 138 Empathy/189 PP sees only immediate room all facets
There are 4 more in Plat and a couple in Prime, but this is a quick check.
Lofton's reference is that 6 of my Plat Empaths are name variants on Asbhuan, eg. Asbhuun, Asbhuen, Asbhvan, etc. Yes it's intentional for a variety of reasons.
Asbhuan et al
E1: 33 Empathy/32 PP sees PC Empaths
E2: 14 Empathy/25 PP sees nothing
E3: 138 Empathy/189 PP sees only immediate room all facets
There are 4 more in Plat and a couple in Prime, but this is a quick check.
Lofton's reference is that 6 of my Plat Empaths are name variants on Asbhuan, eg. Asbhuun, Asbhuen, Asbhvan, etc. Yes it's intentional for a variety of reasons.
Asbhuan et al
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 04:26 PM CST
Szrael first sensed non-Empaths in the same room with 60 PP, 63 Empathy and 13 Charisma.
It was very inconsistent though, and would only happen in one out of many, many tries. (Like 20 or so). It became more and more consistent from there, with the ability to sense non-Empaths in the same room almost every time at about 100 ranks in each.
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 293 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
It was very inconsistent though, and would only happen in one out of many, many tries. (Like 20 or so). It became more and more consistent from there, with the ability to sense non-Empaths in the same room almost every time at about 100 ranks in each.
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 293 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
Re: Perceive Health on 12/10/2008 04:37 PM CST
I tracked down my logs of Szrael's first perceiving of another Empath two rooms away. She had 199.40 Empathy and 199.68 Power Perceive. 20 or 21 charisma.
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 293 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
Skills Needed for Kaith Partani
Need 293 (500) Empathy.
Have at least 200 in #1 Armor (Light Chain).
Have at least 240 Evasion.
Have at least 160 Shield Usage.
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 06:44 AM CST
182 empathy, 138 pp, charisma 22, intel 24, wis 27, disc 14
all the time
empaths in room
non-empaths in room
empaths 1-room away
It's not just an on-off switch though:
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You fail to sense anything, however.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
(cast gs)
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
You sense (E) from your current position:
The presence of an air elemental.
Roundtime: 9 seconds
To confirm this was not just a bonus of gs...
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You fail to sense anything, however.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
(move rooms)
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
Roundtime: 9 seconds
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
R>
A pure white alfar avenger scratches his neck and looks around with a distinctive lack of paranoia.
>
A pure white alfar avenger scratches his neck and looks around with a distinctive lack of paranoia.
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
You sense (W) from your current position:
The presence of an air elemental.
Roundtime: 8 seconds
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
Tolle says, "Yup yup, 'bout time. What the heck took you so long?"
all the time
empaths in room
non-empaths in room
empaths 1-room away
It's not just an on-off switch though:
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You fail to sense anything, however.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
(cast gs)
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
You sense (E) from your current position:
The presence of an air elemental.
Roundtime: 9 seconds
To confirm this was not just a bonus of gs...
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You fail to sense anything, however.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
(move rooms)
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
Roundtime: 9 seconds
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
Roundtime: 6 seconds
R>
A pure white alfar avenger scratches his neck and looks around with a distinctive lack of paranoia.
>
A pure white alfar avenger scratches his neck and looks around with a distinctive lack of paranoia.
>per heal
You close your eyes, drawing all your thoughts inward, and then slowly reach out to sense the life essences of those around you...
You sense:
The presence of K'miriel Lystrandoniel, a fellow Empath.
A relatively healthy presence nearby.
You sense (W) from your current position:
The presence of an air elemental.
Roundtime: 8 seconds
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
Tolle says, "Yup yup, 'bout time. What the heck took you so long?"
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 07:19 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 11:26 AM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 01:35 PM CST
Don't have any test on Francelia's perceive health ability, but I do know that her Charisma is not one of the stats she boosted frequently, so I am not sure how much that goes in to perceiving health in other rooms. At 30th circle with the empathy that goes with that circle, over 190 in power perceive, and higher mental and discipline stats, she was able to perceive the health of those in the next rooms every 3 out of 4 times. I did find that it was easier to do this in a room where the mana was good. 5 circles later with over 240 in power perceive and more charisma under her belt she is able to sense critters and things in the rooms around her.
Don't know if this adds to the testing data you all have gathered, but just wanted to chime in and say I don't know that charisma has a huge impact.
The Mind behind Francelia (traveling Empath)
Don't know if this adds to the testing data you all have gathered, but just wanted to chime in and say I don't know that charisma has a huge impact.
The Mind behind Francelia (traveling Empath)
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 03:49 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 04:38 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 04:48 PM CST
Re: Perceive Health on 12/11/2008 07:40 PM CST