I havent seen Troy yet, but am much looking forward to it and my girlfriend just has to see the Pitt, so we will go, for sure. The Spartans, btw, were not a military power during the time of Troy's ascendancy. They didnt come into their own until after the Lycurgan reforms, which is c.750B.C. The Trojan War either occurred around 1100 B.C. or 1300 B.C., whichever theory you prefer...possibly as early as 1900 B.C., but thats unlikely. So while Sparta was a city (town? village?) during this time, it was not a major one in the Greek peninsula.

And I thought politics was banned here, but since the topic is broached and going Im gonna comment, too. I personally voted for Ronald Reagan twice and still dont regret it (the Demos didnt give me much of an alternative), but I think he stank like fish as a president. He is largely responsible for the huge deficit and debt we currently have...him and his 600 ship navy (where did it go?). He, along with King George I are responsible for the ultra-conservative courts we currently have which are daily signing away our constitutional rights and liberties. Time is the big judge of how well a president did, and I believe time will condemn Ronnie as mediocre at best.

Q.

The Iliad is not the only source for the Trojan War, and while Im sure that anything that comes out of Hollywood is far from reality, there are many other sources out there that relate the same tales (Cypria, by author unknown; Aithiopis, by Arctinos of Miletus; The Little Iliad, by Leches of Mytilene; the Sack of Troy, also by Arctinos of Miletus; the Returns, by Agias of Troizen; and the Telegony, by Eugamon of Cyrene are a few...check the Loeb Collection for more). Menelaus (Pitt) was the King of Troy, and only one of 19 Aegean kings to participate, so that would put his total of the troops in the 5-10% range...hardly a large proportion...and I reiterate...Sparta was not a land power until after the Lycurgan reforms....in fact, they were known as slothful and soft...hence, the reforms that built them into a military power. It would be simply silly to make them the Spartans that held the pass at Thermopylae or drove the Persians away at Plaetea...its like comparing the Americans at Bunker Hill to the Americans at Bataan...miles and years away from each other.

Q.

umm Quick, isnt menalaus the brother to agememnon, and in the movie, mr naked butt pitt, yes his naked ass is shown many times, he was Achilles.

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Clynlyn

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Thanks for the references. I guess what I'm looking for, since you mentioned that the Spartans were wimpy before the reforms, is something that discusses the change in their society from pre-reform to post-reform. I know that some bright history guy out there has compiled something. On a side note of fiction, if you haven't read the book "Spartan" by Valerio Manfredi then you're missing out on a great work. He also wrote a three book series on Alexander (fiction).

Derik