>>>Ok, why is a thief allowed to repeatedly pick your pocket even when you keep catching them?

Uhhh, cause the thief outclasses you?

>>>If you are back stabbed, why the heck can they just hide again in seconds and do it again.

See above.

>>>what a chicken poop way to fight. it does not give the victim even a chance to fight back, just stand there and be a pin cushion.

Uhhh...duh? That's the point. If you can't find me, you can't hit me. If you can't hit me, I can't lose.

>>>So, my final question is why is the set up for theives so slanted to their advantage.

That's just so ridiculous it's funny.

---

DT

<<what a chicken poop way to fight. it does not give the victim even a chance to fight back,

You are fighting with your life on the line, the object is to win, not to make sure the guy trying to kill you has a better chance.


Sylvado

"It's not much of an adventure without risk."

because your perception sucks.

be glad for the training.

why the hell you think thieves pickpocket each other in the <former> guildhall?


~Weak of arm,crazy roar;
terrible aim,awful health;
broken fingers,no real stealth;
leave em dead,stabbed some more;
lost your coins,on the floor;
greetings!now you're out the door~
>

Because the thief was wearing chain and looking to pick a fight?
It happens.
Not all thieves are like that but a few like to work their stealth and kill folks.

Jerevth
"For no one in this world can you trust, not men, not women, not beasts. (points to his sword) This you can trust."
Conan's Father

>Train your stealing and perception for situations like this in the future.
Stealing no longer protects from being stolen from.


______________________________________
Your mind hears Elriic thinking, "Hey George? Yeah Bill? What was that bump in the road? I dunno Bill? Did it squish? Yep.. Oh well."

>>>Stealing no longer protects from being stolen from.

Reference the post?

---

Blue Fire

Happen to know when this will be implemented or if it already has been?

I wonder myself how thieves can pick pockets from missile range. They must have REALLY long arms.

If we're looking for reality, let's start there. Put em at melee where it's more difficult for them to hide, and they are in range of my bastard sword.

Just one Barb's opinion.

Gruesome

>>Again, your idea has been brought up before. You aren't looking at it from the aspect of a non-combatent.<<

I figure a switch would be the happy medium. Player's decision if their character will automatically leap back (and move to missile) from a theft attempt, or keep with the thief and stay within melee range. Possibly add some sort of Escaping check on the thief end for skill-based glee.

Larcus' Player

---

"It's a metaphor of human bloody existence, a dragon. And if that wasn't bad enough, it's also a bloody great hot flying thing." -- Terry Pratchett

>Again, your idea has been brought up before. You aren't looking at it from the aspect of a non-combatent. Say a 5th level, or even a 25th level trader catches someone stealing, a 50th level pickpocket <Of any guild>. Does that trader want to have the pickpocket at melee? Hell no. The trader wants to just keep on truckin', and accuse at the next outpost. Or, say a paladin is In town and catches said pickpocket, that paladin wants to go run to the guardhouse and accuse for soul juice and not take justice into his own hands. Or - say a 5th thief is pickpocketed by a 50th level WM. Said thief wants to teach the WM a lesson, so he runs to his own guildleader and the thugs give the WM a "lesson". :-) Leave things the way they are, they're better for everyone in the circumstances listed above and in most circumstances.

I have to disagree, respectfully, but completely. Combatant or not, pickpocketing is an invasive, personal space-disrespecting, highly dangerous act. While it's admirable to point to cases where it would benefit the victim, this is neither altruistic or logical. Rather than "fix" the symmetry between the criminal and the prey, the suggestion to allow a current violation is not the answer.

The first premise is to admit the truth. When the criminal dips his hand, ever-so-gently, into the pocket of his victim, he is within striking distance. Make no attempts to justify polearm or missile range...stealing could not be accomplished with a 10' foot pole! Therefore, we must push this ideal to the forefront first. Stealing occurs at melee range!

Once agreed upon, NOW we can look at the two arguments provided above:
1. A trader who doesn't want to be interrupted on his route, and
2. A paladin who wants to avoid melee conflict and run to the guard house.

Is the answer to ignore the melee proximity? No, not at all. The solution lays within the mechanics; a stealth melee proximity. If a thief intends to steal, he should be taking a chance as well...

...And ultimately, I feel all stealth should be treated this way because advancing in stealth is not something you do fast..it's slow and meticulous, methodical and an detailed process. Consider the objections, when you advance on a person normally, you're basically heading directly to them, perhaps even running, but in plain sight and unconcerned about being spotted. Not so when you advance in stealth. In the skulking mode, you slow down. You weave, stay out of periphery, and maintain your focus on alerting the prey. It's slower.

How does this tie in to pickpocketing? Simple. When a paladin or trader catches you "on his back", you come out of hiding. This is what should be possible:
1. The trader or paladin should be able to strike you, as if at melee. If he does so, melee combat ranges commence, or
2. He can walk away as if he were at missile range.

You, the pickpocket, have two options:
1. Stand there and let the person decide if he wants to strike you or walk away...or
2. Begin retreating (which should involve some roundtime).

Okies and why they at it when someone use slap verb put em at melee with me, And the kick one, pinch, lick few people I'd like to hurt for that,And there is plenty more

Having had my pocket picked two times in real life (gotta Las Vegas; I must look like a mark) I think that range is an issue, but not in the sense that it's presented here.

Pick pocket works in crowded areas, places where everyone would be assumed to be closer than missle range, where their proximity won't be considered odd. Sidewalks, restaraunts, shops, railcars, malls- people stand relatively close together because that's what people do. If you want to assume that people in town are all at missle range, then you've got a really weird bunch of people living in a giant-sized town. Combat ranges really can't be considered the same as 'social ranges', otherwise people would have to close to melee range to have a conversation without yelling. In towns, you're liable to get your pocket picked -regardless of combat range- unless you want to skulk around like a leper.

That said, there are a lot of places where people where naturally assumed to be at long 'social range', like within the wilderness and trade roads. People usually do not allow strangers to get that close to them in non-civilized areas. It's a lot harder to pickpocket someone if it's just you and them and a stretch of highway.

I think, outside city settings, a stealthy melee approach would be required, to close that uncomforable distance. The cover of darkness is a definate advantage in these situations and should be a determining factor. This might have something to do with the tradition of banditry now that I think about it: they pick your pockets in the city, they hold you up in the country, because the idea of picking pockets on the road is pretty silly unless you've got a good schtick (pardon me m'lord...help an old lady with her parcels?).

-Mersc Copperfire's player.