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>>As of a few months ago if someone is engaged with you and hidden and you try to just CAST, it won't work and it'll act like you do need a target.
Hax way to see if someone is engaged to you.
Individuals, families, countries, continents are destroyed at the heavy hand of Vinjince.
-GM Abasha
>> Hax way to see if someone is engaged to you.
Good way to kill your friends if no one is, though. :(
Rev. Reene
Xalahai says to you, "Don't you know me? I'm Jhipicalain, the awesomest warrior mage ever."
Xalahai says, "Then I will go hide in my tower where nobody can get to me. Because I am the greatest. Ever."
Good way to kill your friends if no one is, though. :(
Rev. Reene
Xalahai says to you, "Don't you know me? I'm Jhipicalain, the awesomest warrior mage ever."
Xalahai says, "Then I will go hide in my tower where nobody can get to me. Because I am the greatest. Ever."
Hiding needs some conceptual work.
If you're trying to spam CL to hit someone who is advancing on you from hiding, the hider did something wrong and their concealment shouldn't protect them from the spell.
That said, this issue will be resolved when it gets resolved. It sounds like it depends on a lot of systems that are already getting heavily worked over.
Also, the pulsed spell mechanics don't represent a huge nerf to any of our spells. VOI acts like it should. HULP gained some effectiveness. If you win the HULP contest, there is no change to how our spells work.
Avaya <--Not female.
(But supportive)
Gnome WM of TF
AIM: AvayaTF
If you're trying to spam CL to hit someone who is advancing on you from hiding, the hider did something wrong and their concealment shouldn't protect them from the spell.
That said, this issue will be resolved when it gets resolved. It sounds like it depends on a lot of systems that are already getting heavily worked over.
Also, the pulsed spell mechanics don't represent a huge nerf to any of our spells. VOI acts like it should. HULP gained some effectiveness. If you win the HULP contest, there is no change to how our spells work.
Avaya <--Not female.
(But supportive)
Gnome WM of TF
AIM: AvayaTF
>>This wasn't actually true in the sense of being...well...true. Paladin minimum hindrance was and is always less than WM minimum hindrance using YS. Thieves were and are always better at stealth at equal ranks because of their passive bonuses.
Sure it was, because I never said YS made WMs better at armor than Paladins or better than Thieves at hiding. I said it made the survival/armor tertiary guild better at hiding in plate, specifically, than the armor primary and the survival primaries, not armor in general and stealth in general. It absolutely was true because:
A) Thieves do not and never have possessed any way to reduce armor hindrance, and plate has always pwned their stealth hardcore.
B) Paladins have several restrictions placed on the effectiveness of their stealth for "flavor," whereas WMs do not.
If you really insist on concrete evidence, I'll happily point you to the old practice of training hiding in plate armor, and the existence of high-level WMs who had plate and stealth ranks equal to their other combat ranks without ever once removing said armor. I will also remind that this practice was completely unique to the Warrior Mage tribe.
"Limited in nature yet infinite in desire - men are like fallen gods."
- Alphonse de Lamartine
Sure it was, because I never said YS made WMs better at armor than Paladins or better than Thieves at hiding. I said it made the survival/armor tertiary guild better at hiding in plate, specifically, than the armor primary and the survival primaries, not armor in general and stealth in general. It absolutely was true because:
A) Thieves do not and never have possessed any way to reduce armor hindrance, and plate has always pwned their stealth hardcore.
B) Paladins have several restrictions placed on the effectiveness of their stealth for "flavor," whereas WMs do not.
If you really insist on concrete evidence, I'll happily point you to the old practice of training hiding in plate armor, and the existence of high-level WMs who had plate and stealth ranks equal to their other combat ranks without ever once removing said armor. I will also remind that this practice was completely unique to the Warrior Mage tribe.
"Limited in nature yet infinite in desire - men are like fallen gods."
- Alphonse de Lamartine
>>HULP gained some effectiveness. If you win the HULP contest, there is no change to how our spells work.
I don't see the reasoning behind it. You're not recasting your spell, DB/Rimefang has already been cast. Why should HULP prevent the spell from working? Is HULP intended to do that? If so then ok, great for clerics. If not then fix it please.
I don't see the reasoning behind it. You're not recasting your spell, DB/Rimefang has already been cast. Why should HULP prevent the spell from working? Is HULP intended to do that? If so then ok, great for clerics. If not then fix it please.
Lack of a CAST verb does not mean there is not some kind of process involved in invoking DB that is akin to casting.
I'm pretty sure HULP also stops moonblade spells from working.
Rev. Reene
Xalahai says to you, "Don't you know me? I'm Jhipicalain, the awesomest warrior mage ever."
Xalahai says, "Then I will go hide in my tower where nobody can get to me. Because I am the greatest. Ever."
I'm pretty sure HULP also stops moonblade spells from working.
Rev. Reene
Xalahai says to you, "Don't you know me? I'm Jhipicalain, the awesomest warrior mage ever."
Xalahai says, "Then I will go hide in my tower where nobody can get to me. Because I am the greatest. Ever."
>And why stop there, why not have HULP completely remove all buffs on the caster as well. Be consistent if you're going to do stuff like that.
This ... would only make sense if you knew nothing about how magic works conceptually or mechanically.
Cast a weak Rimefang and see what happens against undead targets. Or, what doesn't.
"Magic has rules and so does posting on these forums." -Annwyl
This ... would only make sense if you knew nothing about how magic works conceptually or mechanically.
Cast a weak Rimefang and see what happens against undead targets. Or, what doesn't.
"Magic has rules and so does posting on these forums." -Annwyl
>>Lack of a CAST verb does not mean there is not some kind of process involved in invoking DB that is akin to casting.
I'm not talking about just the verb itself.
>>I'm pretty sure HULP also stops moonblade spells from working.
OK so what exactly does that prove?
>>Maybe the act of spitting fire is a magic process since it relies on TM? Maybe you should get the spit verb changed to another s verb. You could avoid all these silly checks and balances.
>>This ... would only make sense if you knew nothing about how magic works conceptually or mechanically.
I didn't say it made sense. Why don't one of you geniuses explain to me then why it makes sense for an already cast spell to be prevented from working.
I'm not talking about just the verb itself.
>>I'm pretty sure HULP also stops moonblade spells from working.
OK so what exactly does that prove?
>>Maybe the act of spitting fire is a magic process since it relies on TM? Maybe you should get the spit verb changed to another s verb. You could avoid all these silly checks and balances.
>>This ... would only make sense if you knew nothing about how magic works conceptually or mechanically.
I didn't say it made sense. Why don't one of you geniuses explain to me then why it makes sense for an already cast spell to be prevented from working.
Hey, until someone can explain why CL seeks out targets intuitively with something more substantial than "no one knows, that's just how it works" I'm content to accept that answer for perceived downsides or inconsistencies with regard to spells.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
It avoids inanimate objects in favor of PCs and mobs. I'm no expert, but I've always thought various metals are more attractive to lightning and electricity than a person or creature is.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
I'm asking why the change to HULP, I don't really care what the reasoning behind it is i just want to make sure that this change is really what was intended. Was there a "bug" so that for all these years you could have DB'd someone when HULP'd or is the bug that you can't because of the recent changes.
Your example and hatred of CL is really stupid by the way.
Your example and hatred of CL is really stupid by the way.
>>I'm asking why the change to HULP, I don't really care what the reasoning behind it is i just want to make sure that this change is really what was intended. Was there a "bug" so that for all these years you could have DB'd someone when HULP'd or is the bug that you can't because of the recent changes.
Yes, it was a beneficial bug, that lasted years. They happen, there was one with ES that lasted a greater part of something like 7 years before it was fixed.
That or it was just never intended, and was redone for magic consistencies. Who cares which really, its not going to go back.
HULP interferes with Matrixes, while you cast the spell on yourself this the primary pattern is untouched, the targeting matrix isn't formed until you actually preform the spit action, this HULP then interferes with the targeting matrix.
It makes sense, whether you want to admit it or not.
_______________________
I want to confess all my sins. But my heart is empty. That emptiness is a Mirror and when I stare into it I only see my reflection and feel insolence and rage.
-The Seventh Seal
Yes, it was a beneficial bug, that lasted years. They happen, there was one with ES that lasted a greater part of something like 7 years before it was fixed.
That or it was just never intended, and was redone for magic consistencies. Who cares which really, its not going to go back.
HULP interferes with Matrixes, while you cast the spell on yourself this the primary pattern is untouched, the targeting matrix isn't formed until you actually preform the spit action, this HULP then interferes with the targeting matrix.
It makes sense, whether you want to admit it or not.
_______________________
I want to confess all my sins. But my heart is empty. That emptiness is a Mirror and when I stare into it I only see my reflection and feel insolence and rage.
-The Seventh Seal
>>HULP interferes with Matrixes, while you cast the spell on yourself this the primary pattern is untouched, the targeting matrix isn't formed until you actually preform the spit action, this HULP then interferes with the targeting matrix.
>>It makes sense, whether you want to admit it or not.
Maybe i'm going about asking in a wrong way, but i suppose it's the nature of these boards for everyone to be abrasive when replying so it rubs off on me as well.
That explanation does make sense, I had no idea that HULP interfered with targeting matrices. I thought its function was to prevent the target from casting spells (forming a spell pattern and channeling mana into it to make it work).
>>It makes sense, whether you want to admit it or not.
Maybe i'm going about asking in a wrong way, but i suppose it's the nature of these boards for everyone to be abrasive when replying so it rubs off on me as well.
That explanation does make sense, I had no idea that HULP interfered with targeting matrices. I thought its function was to prevent the target from casting spells (forming a spell pattern and channeling mana into it to make it work).
>I thought its function was to prevent the target from casting spells (forming a spell pattern and channeling mana into it to make it work).
A target matrix is very similar to a spell pattern, I think. However, if this is the reason for it, it should prevent spitting entirely, it should reduce the accuracy to base non-target... Which it is already, I think. Interferring with a target matrix shouldn't cause the spell to fail completely.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Expert Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
A target matrix is very similar to a spell pattern, I think. However, if this is the reason for it, it should prevent spitting entirely, it should reduce the accuracy to base non-target... Which it is already, I think. Interferring with a target matrix shouldn't cause the spell to fail completely.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Expert Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
>>That explanation does make sense, I had no idea that HULP interfered with targeting matrices. I thought its function was to prevent the target from casting spells (forming a spell pattern and channeling mana into it to make it work).
It does both. I tried to point this out before because it's pretty apparent from the messaging that Rime gives you while you're under the effects of HULP.
>>Maybe i'm going about asking in a wrong way, but i suppose it's the nature of these boards for everyone to be abrasive when replying so it rubs off on me as well.
Blunt responses come off as abrasive in text. They're not always meant to be that way.
It does both. I tried to point this out before because it's pretty apparent from the messaging that Rime gives you while you're under the effects of HULP.
>>Maybe i'm going about asking in a wrong way, but i suppose it's the nature of these boards for everyone to be abrasive when replying so it rubs off on me as well.
Blunt responses come off as abrasive in text. They're not always meant to be that way.
<<Your example and hatred of CL is really stupid by the way.>>
Where did I say I hated CL? It seems like a valuable tool and I'd be glad to have something similar.
Saying it's stupid doesn't address the point I made either.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
Where did I say I hated CL? It seems like a valuable tool and I'd be glad to have something similar.
Saying it's stupid doesn't address the point I made either.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
AGH I can't type... take 2...
>That explanation does make sense, I had no idea that HULP interfered with targeting matrices....
Not 100 percent relevant, though... Again, some experimenting with min-prep spells and undead targets should show you some things in parallel to spell interference.
Go and do this thing; learn that spell interference is just now more consistent with other stuff that interfered with spells (barrier spells, undeadMR) mostly-always have. Does it make sense in the lore? I have no idea. But ... this is just how it's worked in practice.
"Magic has rules and so does posting on these forums." -Annwyl
>That explanation does make sense, I had no idea that HULP interfered with targeting matrices....
Not 100 percent relevant, though... Again, some experimenting with min-prep spells and undead targets should show you some things in parallel to spell interference.
Go and do this thing; learn that spell interference is just now more consistent with other stuff that interfered with spells (barrier spells, undeadMR) mostly-always have. Does it make sense in the lore? I have no idea. But ... this is just how it's worked in practice.
"Magic has rules and so does posting on these forums." -Annwyl
Raising a zombie thread should get you divine outrage IRL.
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
