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I have had the interesting perspective of seeing learning from the GEnie and Beta days, and todays learning and I want everyone who is between circle 8 and circle 15 to understand this simple fact when trying to figure out why they can't learn:
Warrior Mages are Tert Survival (Evasion) and Tert Armor (Armor). What that means is that a typical warrior mage at circle 10 most likely will be at 40 TM, 30 Parry/Multi and 20 Evasion/Armor.
You're probably not learning TM from your enemies and are being eaten alive every time you try to move up. Here is a few easy steps to follow until you get a bit more experience and learn spells to mitigate he problem:
1) Do NOT Learn TM from a class. I find that if you do this, your TM will WAY outpace your defensive skills. Instead try and get an Evasion class.
2) Make sure to keep your experience pools full as often as possible with evasion and armor.
3) Accept the fact that you just need to spend more time FIGHTING and avoiding being hit and doing things in armor. To mitigate this, learn your magic and harness skill in combat and it won't be so boring.
Warrior Mages have very potent spells to make up for the Tert Armor/Survival learning curve, but you'll never get to use it if you give up.
My 2 coppers.
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
1) Do NOT Learn TM from a class. I find that if you do this, your TM will WAY outpace your defensive skills. Instead try and get an Evasion class.
Elriic<---
I totally agree on this, I actually just started figuring this out recently. Now I'll only take classes in things like Evasion, shield, first aid and what not. Funny thing to have only just figured this out after all these years. I'd snicker at myself but I already do that far to often. Also agreed on the rest of your remarks Elriic.
Jim and his inner elf.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." G.B.S.
Elriic<---
I totally agree on this, I actually just started figuring this out recently. Now I'll only take classes in things like Evasion, shield, first aid and what not. Funny thing to have only just figured this out after all these years. I'd snicker at myself but I already do that far to often. Also agreed on the rest of your remarks Elriic.
Jim and his inner elf.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." G.B.S.
Okay, I feel compelled to comment on this. As I understand this theory it goes something like this:
"if TM exceeds defenses by too much, then you can't learn TM and defenses in the same place, so you should concentrate on defenses rather than TM."
Now, while I can see attempting to stay balanced, I have a hard time figuring out why anyone would make an effort to not learn TM in order to keep it balanced. One person said not to listen to a TM class. Are you saying if that is the only class being taught, not to listen to it? Because that really makes no sense to me. The worst case scenario from having TM way higher than defenses is that you won't learn TM from the same creatures that teach you defenses. Lets compare two mages
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Which is more survivable? Well mage A not only has more tdp's to spend on stats, but in the case of an invasion will be able to kill things that mage B won't be able to touch.
If your strategy was to stay in a hunting area, even if you out grew its TM value, to keep learning defenses, I understand that. However, to avoid learning TM during that time, from classes while hunting or classes while sitting, seems to be penalizing yourself for no reason.
As a cleric, our gap between TM and defenses are normally smaller than yours. I never consider this to be a benefit. I often need to hunt places that teach me no TM to learn skills, yet wish my TM was higher so that I could attack those stronger creatures that I do encounter. And finally- killing things with TM that could otherwise smear our puny mage defenses is very exhilerating.
Flavius
"if TM exceeds defenses by too much, then you can't learn TM and defenses in the same place, so you should concentrate on defenses rather than TM."
Now, while I can see attempting to stay balanced, I have a hard time figuring out why anyone would make an effort to not learn TM in order to keep it balanced. One person said not to listen to a TM class. Are you saying if that is the only class being taught, not to listen to it? Because that really makes no sense to me. The worst case scenario from having TM way higher than defenses is that you won't learn TM from the same creatures that teach you defenses. Lets compare two mages
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Which is more survivable? Well mage A not only has more tdp's to spend on stats, but in the case of an invasion will be able to kill things that mage B won't be able to touch.
If your strategy was to stay in a hunting area, even if you out grew its TM value, to keep learning defenses, I understand that. However, to avoid learning TM during that time, from classes while hunting or classes while sitting, seems to be penalizing yourself for no reason.
As a cleric, our gap between TM and defenses are normally smaller than yours. I never consider this to be a benefit. I often need to hunt places that teach me no TM to learn skills, yet wish my TM was higher so that I could attack those stronger creatures that I do encounter. And finally- killing things with TM that could otherwise smear our puny mage defenses is very exhilerating.
Flavius
Okay, I feel compelled to comment on this. As I understand this theory it goes something like this:
"if TM exceeds defenses by too much, then you can't learn TM and defenses in the same place, so you should concentrate on defenses rather than TM."
Now, while I can see attempting to stay balanced, I have a hard time figuring out why anyone would make an effort to not learn TM in order to keep it balanced. One person said not to listen to a TM class. Are you saying if that is the only class being taught, not to listen to it? Because that really makes no sense to me. The worst case scenario from having TM way higher than defenses is that you won't learn TM from the same creatures that teach you defenses. Lets compare two mages
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Which is more survivable? Well mage A not only has more tdp's to spend on stats, but in the case of an invasion will be able to kill things that mage B won't be able to touch.
If your strategy was to stay in a hunting area, even if you out grew its TM value, to keep learning defenses, I understand that. However, to avoid learning TM during that time, from classes while hunting or classes while sitting, seems to be penalizing yourself for no reason.
As a cleric, our gap between TM and defenses are normally smaller than yours. I never consider this to be a benefit. I often need to hunt places that teach me no TM to learn skills, yet wish my TM was higher so that I could attack those stronger creatures that I do encounter. And finally- killing things with TM that could otherwise smear our puny mage defenses is very exhilerating.
Flavius
Flavius, your comments are well stated. Allow me to elaborate. If a warrior mage according to my way of thinking and by my thoughts were to allow his or her targeted magic to begin outpacing their defensive abilities, you'd run into a situation where it will become increasingly difficult to actually learn TM because you're too busy being pumelled into the ground. By what CAN teach you.
Lets look at your example:
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Mage A, while he would be more useful in an invasion then mage b, would be in a tense situation when he decided to learn rank 201 of TM (hehe). He would not be able to stand toe-to-toe with a critter that would teach 201 because of his low defenses. He would be forced into one of 3 scenarios:
A) Learn all future TM in classes
B) Play massive catchup on his defenses (thereby making this debate moot as my original post made it clear that my strategy advocated avoiding hunting in different areas for skill groups and avoiding the catchup game)
C) Continue on the path defined, trying to hunt with inadequate defenses and praying nothing shoots a missile or gets to melee; Further, even if you play the retreat game, with such a huge gap (See the earlier 'Whats your gap' thread) chances are you might not be able to retreat all the time...... * Warrior Mage just bit the dust!
I'm not saying this is how it is for everyone. I'm offering my strategy to avoid outpacing your offense from your defense.
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
"if TM exceeds defenses by too much, then you can't learn TM and defenses in the same place, so you should concentrate on defenses rather than TM."
Now, while I can see attempting to stay balanced, I have a hard time figuring out why anyone would make an effort to not learn TM in order to keep it balanced. One person said not to listen to a TM class. Are you saying if that is the only class being taught, not to listen to it? Because that really makes no sense to me. The worst case scenario from having TM way higher than defenses is that you won't learn TM from the same creatures that teach you defenses. Lets compare two mages
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Which is more survivable? Well mage A not only has more tdp's to spend on stats, but in the case of an invasion will be able to kill things that mage B won't be able to touch.
If your strategy was to stay in a hunting area, even if you out grew its TM value, to keep learning defenses, I understand that. However, to avoid learning TM during that time, from classes while hunting or classes while sitting, seems to be penalizing yourself for no reason.
As a cleric, our gap between TM and defenses are normally smaller than yours. I never consider this to be a benefit. I often need to hunt places that teach me no TM to learn skills, yet wish my TM was higher so that I could attack those stronger creatures that I do encounter. And finally- killing things with TM that could otherwise smear our puny mage defenses is very exhilerating.
Flavius
Flavius, your comments are well stated. Allow me to elaborate. If a warrior mage according to my way of thinking and by my thoughts were to allow his or her targeted magic to begin outpacing their defensive abilities, you'd run into a situation where it will become increasingly difficult to actually learn TM because you're too busy being pumelled into the ground. By what CAN teach you.
Lets look at your example:
mage A: TM 200, defenses 100
mage B: TM 120, defenses 100
Mage A, while he would be more useful in an invasion then mage b, would be in a tense situation when he decided to learn rank 201 of TM (hehe). He would not be able to stand toe-to-toe with a critter that would teach 201 because of his low defenses. He would be forced into one of 3 scenarios:
A) Learn all future TM in classes
B) Play massive catchup on his defenses (thereby making this debate moot as my original post made it clear that my strategy advocated avoiding hunting in different areas for skill groups and avoiding the catchup game)
C) Continue on the path defined, trying to hunt with inadequate defenses and praying nothing shoots a missile or gets to melee; Further, even if you play the retreat game, with such a huge gap (See the earlier 'Whats your gap' thread) chances are you might not be able to retreat all the time...... * Warrior Mage just bit the dust!
I'm not saying this is how it is for everyone. I'm offering my strategy to avoid outpacing your offense from your defense.
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
I agree with Flavius, and have posted a similar opinion a few times in the past. However, I think you're missing his point.
He's saying that some people (think Gyren) will avoid learning any TM to keep it at the same level as their weapon. Flavius is saying, why not just continue to learn TM until you've capped the creature you're hunting and then wait to move up the ladder until your defenses are adequate. Get all your TM first rather than trying to space it out.
Nester
He's saying that some people (think Gyren) will avoid learning any TM to keep it at the same level as their weapon. Flavius is saying, why not just continue to learn TM until you've capped the creature you're hunting and then wait to move up the ladder until your defenses are adequate. Get all your TM first rather than trying to space it out.
Nester
<<Yeah- what Nester said I said.....
And what kind of warmie board is this? I haven't been flamed once for my comments! Everyone is being so civil I feel like rerolling....>>
Horrid isn't it? Someone replaced them all with fluffy pink bunnies.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
And what kind of warmie board is this? I haven't been flamed once for my comments! Everyone is being so civil I feel like rerolling....>>
Horrid isn't it? Someone replaced them all with fluffy pink bunnies.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
>And what kind of warmie board is this? I haven't been flamed once for my comments! Everyone is being so civil I feel like rerolling....
Blah blah blah WARRIOR mage blah blah blah blah Lore skills blah blah blah scripting blah blah blah Magical Devices blah blah blah WARRIOR mage blah blah blah.
Nester
"I have an orange car, it's half orange and half car."
-Frogspawn
Blah blah blah WARRIOR mage blah blah blah blah Lore skills blah blah blah scripting blah blah blah Magical Devices blah blah blah WARRIOR mage blah blah blah.
Nester
"I have an orange car, it's half orange and half car."
-Frogspawn
>>Horrid isn't it? Someone replaced them all with fluffy pink bunnies.
Ha-ha! The fluffy pink snuggle-bunnies of DOOM strike again! Go and conquer, my minions!
Ryeka
Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy
A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy
Ha-ha! The fluffy pink snuggle-bunnies of DOOM strike again! Go and conquer, my minions!
Ryeka
Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy
A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy
<<He's saying that some people (think Gyren) will avoid learning any TM to keep it at the same level as their weapon. Flavius is saying, why not just continue to learn TM until you've capped the creature you're hunting and then wait to move up the ladder until your defenses are adequate. Get all your TM first rather than trying to space it out.>>
<<Nester>>
I wanted to weigh in on this issue. Nester I would agree with you except for one thing. You're not factoring player enjoyment into the situation. Most players I know don't enjoy staying in the same critter for what seems like forever and most do not like to hunt while learning only one or two skills. I know I don't. I also don't like retreating all the time or having to load up on SW,YS, SUF,ES at all times just to stay alive as I train. In the earlier thread I agree that character A has more raw power but I argue that character B will enjoy Dragonrealms more, die less and probably complain less about being survival tert. Let's face it it's no fun to die as soon as something get's to melee.
I'll put it like this. Thoraxia judges his hunting level by his defenses rather than his offenses. At level for me means I can stand with one critter and have at least one more in the room and not have to run.
<<Nester>>
I wanted to weigh in on this issue. Nester I would agree with you except for one thing. You're not factoring player enjoyment into the situation. Most players I know don't enjoy staying in the same critter for what seems like forever and most do not like to hunt while learning only one or two skills. I know I don't. I also don't like retreating all the time or having to load up on SW,YS, SUF,ES at all times just to stay alive as I train. In the earlier thread I agree that character A has more raw power but I argue that character B will enjoy Dragonrealms more, die less and probably complain less about being survival tert. Let's face it it's no fun to die as soon as something get's to melee.
I'll put it like this. Thoraxia judges his hunting level by his defenses rather than his offenses. At level for me means I can stand with one critter and have at least one more in the room and not have to run.
I'll go days and weeks, even did three months, without training target.
My other magics are up so much higher now, though, the target will lock in five or six shots and then I go back to training the four weapons.
But then, I train so many other skills I get TDP left and right so I'm not missing out on much for not circling as fast.
Jerevth
"For no one in this world can you trust, not men, not women, not beasts. (points to his sword) This you can trust."
Conan's Father
My other magics are up so much higher now, though, the target will lock in five or six shots and then I go back to training the four weapons.
But then, I train so many other skills I get TDP left and right so I'm not missing out on much for not circling as fast.
Jerevth
"For no one in this world can you trust, not men, not women, not beasts. (points to his sword) This you can trust."
Conan's Father
Interesting thread.
Target Magic for me has taken a major back seat. For years it's been "must learn more target, must learn more target, must learn more target". But now, circle wise, I need only weapons. After that, teaching and scholarship. So I'm doing alot of guild sitting these days.
Currently, my hunting ground teaches "just ok". It's still at my level (Peccs/fens/trolls) but I don't lock up very fast. The problem I have right now is boredom. I've been in Lang going on my second year and well . . . . I wish I can move. Big peccs can teach great, but I don't like dieing once in while. Plus I realllllly am making a big effort to learn to pop my own boxes. After hunting in Adanf and getting two backpack full of boxes and not being able to opening has caused me to rethink my character's learning strategy. So I need to have a critter that can provide me with boxes. That's where orcs come in. Unfortunately, I need another year or two before I can handle those One-Kill Warcats' I've been hearing about.
Luckily, the gap between my weapon, defeneses and target is slowly closing. Hopefully in another year, I can progress to a new hunting area that can provide me with optimal learning. I rarely lock target in my current area primarily because I'm reaching the caps, target wise. In fact, I don't even try to lock my target. As long as I'm in the learning or thoughtful range, I'm actually happy (for now).
My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me (again . . for now.)
Just my two lirums.
Woodcubb of Ilithi
Target Magic for me has taken a major back seat. For years it's been "must learn more target, must learn more target, must learn more target". But now, circle wise, I need only weapons. After that, teaching and scholarship. So I'm doing alot of guild sitting these days.
Currently, my hunting ground teaches "just ok". It's still at my level (Peccs/fens/trolls) but I don't lock up very fast. The problem I have right now is boredom. I've been in Lang going on my second year and well . . . . I wish I can move. Big peccs can teach great, but I don't like dieing once in while. Plus I realllllly am making a big effort to learn to pop my own boxes. After hunting in Adanf and getting two backpack full of boxes and not being able to opening has caused me to rethink my character's learning strategy. So I need to have a critter that can provide me with boxes. That's where orcs come in. Unfortunately, I need another year or two before I can handle those One-Kill Warcats' I've been hearing about.
Luckily, the gap between my weapon, defeneses and target is slowly closing. Hopefully in another year, I can progress to a new hunting area that can provide me with optimal learning. I rarely lock target in my current area primarily because I'm reaching the caps, target wise. In fact, I don't even try to lock my target. As long as I'm in the learning or thoughtful range, I'm actually happy (for now).
My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me (again . . for now.)
Just my two lirums.
Woodcubb of Ilithi
Thoraxia more power to your strategy. I agree that figuring out what is fun is more important than just training. But as a cleric, who naturally has less TM than a Warmie of similar levels and skills, I would always choose more TM than less. If I am hunting somewhere where my TM doesn't teach me, I am not hurt by this. However, having higher TM than the hunting area will teach makes me much more able to get out of a tight spot. Also higher TM means that I will be able to be more effective during those times when I am really fighting, not training/hunting, during wars or invasions.
Anyway, like I said originally, I couldn't understand why someone would actually avoid listening to a TM class to avoid learning TM so that mundane defenses can catch up, and I still don't.
Flavius
Anyway, like I said originally, I couldn't understand why someone would actually avoid listening to a TM class to avoid learning TM so that mundane defenses can catch up, and I still don't.
Flavius
>>>I'll put it like this. Thoraxia judges his hunting level by his defenses rather than his offenses. At level for me means I can stand with one critter and have at least one more in the room and not have to run.
I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.
Don't choose to not train TM. If you want to train weapons more, good! But once your weapon(s) is(are) MLed, there's no point to not training TM.
Tessaa
You think you've got it
Ohh, you think you've go it
But got it just don't get it
Till' there's nothing at
AaaaaaaaAAAAAAAaaaaaaAAAAAAaaaaaallllll..
I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.
Don't choose to not train TM. If you want to train weapons more, good! But once your weapon(s) is(are) MLed, there's no point to not training TM.
Tessaa
You think you've got it
Ohh, you think you've go it
But got it just don't get it
Till' there's nothing at
AaaaaaaaAAAAAAAaaaaaaAAAAAAaaaaaallllll..
<<<Luckily, the gap between my weapon, defeneses and target is slowly closing. In fact, I don't even try to lock my target. As long as I'm in the learning or thoughtful range, I'm actually happy (for now).>>>
<<<My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me>>>
Looks like you and I are doing the same thing Woodcubb.
<<<I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>>
This is what I consider at level.
Balshan
<<<My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me>>>
Looks like you and I are doing the same thing Woodcubb.
<<<I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>>
This is what I consider at level.
Balshan
<<Anyway, like I said originally, I couldn't understand why someone would actually avoid listening to a TM class to avoid learning TM so that mundane defenses can catch up, and I still don't.>>
Well the original poster suggested not listening to TM and INSTEAD listening to Evasion or Armor or some such. I think keeping our hard to learn but vitally necessary Tert skills learning as much as possible is a very good idea. Keep in mind this was probably targeted to guild sitters who are always after TM classes. I agree that if your gonna listen to a class on a regular basis listen to one that teaches a hard to learn skill not a primary one. In my oppinion that's just lazy.
<<I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>
I agree with you unfortunatly there are many who do nothing more than slaughter anything that enters a room as fast as they can. The hit and run specialist are easy to spot, they are the ones always complaining about our buff spells, complaining that prep times are too long, that spells should be easier to snap, that multi is to hard to learn and that we should have cool looking armor with no weight and no hinderance and protects like HP only better or else I'm leaning and taking all 3000 of my friends with MEEEEEEE!!104710479111
Legal Disclamer: If this does not apply to you assume I'm not talking to you and relax. No whiners were harmed during the making of this post.
Thoraxia the King of PC (oops king is male only, oh well)
PS and yes that was a general you not a specific one
Well the original poster suggested not listening to TM and INSTEAD listening to Evasion or Armor or some such. I think keeping our hard to learn but vitally necessary Tert skills learning as much as possible is a very good idea. Keep in mind this was probably targeted to guild sitters who are always after TM classes. I agree that if your gonna listen to a class on a regular basis listen to one that teaches a hard to learn skill not a primary one. In my oppinion that's just lazy.
<<I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>
I agree with you unfortunatly there are many who do nothing more than slaughter anything that enters a room as fast as they can. The hit and run specialist are easy to spot, they are the ones always complaining about our buff spells, complaining that prep times are too long, that spells should be easier to snap, that multi is to hard to learn and that we should have cool looking armor with no weight and no hinderance and protects like HP only better or else I'm leaning and taking all 3000 of my friends with MEEEEEEE!!104710479111
Legal Disclamer: If this does not apply to you assume I'm not talking to you and relax. No whiners were harmed during the making of this post.
Thoraxia the King of PC (oops king is male only, oh well)
PS and yes that was a general you not a specific one
<<Anyway, like I said originally, I couldn't understand why someone would actually avoid listening to a TM class to avoid learning TM so that mundane defenses can catch up, and I still don't.>>
Well the original poster suggested not listening to TM and INSTEAD listening to Evasion or Armor or some such. I think keeping our hard to learn but vitally necessary Tert skills learning as much as possible is a very good idea. Keep in mind this was probably targeted to guild sitters who are always after TM classes. I agree that if your gonna listen to a class on a regular basis listen to one that teaches a hard to learn skill not a primary one. In my oppinion that's just lazy.
<<I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>
I agree with you unfortunatly there are many who do nothing more than slaughter anything that enters a room as fast as they can. The hit and run specialist are easy to spot, they are the ones always complaining about our buff spells, complaining that prep times are too long, that spells should be easier to snap, that multi is to hard to learn and that we should have cool looking armor with no weight and no hinderance and protects like HP only better or else I'm leaning and taking all 3000 of my friends with MEEEEEEE!!104710479111
Legal Disclamer: If this does not apply to you assume I'm not talking to you and relax. No whiners were harmed during the making of this post.
Thoraxia the King of PC (oops king is male only, oh well)
PS and yes that was a general you not a specific one
Thoraxia said it. I feel that learning TM in a class is less efficient than learning a tert skill, especially evasion or armor.
I want to stress again that according to my way of thinking, keeping your defenses close to TM is extremely important for long term development and happiness. Woodcub, I appologize for singling you out, but your earlier post mentions the very reason why I use my strategy:
<<Luckily, the gap between my weapon, defeneses and target is slowly closing. Hopefully in another year, I can progress to a new hunting area that can provide me with optimal learning. I rarely lock target in my current area primarily because I'm reaching the caps, target wise. In fact, I don't even try to lock my target. As long as I'm in the learning or thoughtful range, I'm actually happy (for now). >>
<< My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me (again . . for now.) >>
I believe that if one were to follow the strategy I laid out much earlier in the posts and have pasted below once more for those who might have missed it, a warrior mage can mostly avoid the backtraining paradox which seems to have become the norm for warrior mages while Elriic was on ice for 5 years.
<< Original Post and Elriic's Comments on Training Target and Warrior Maging in General: >>
Warrior Mages are Tert Survival (Evasion) and Tert Armor (Armor). What that means is that a typical warrior mage at circle 10 most likely will be at 40 TM, 30 Parry/Multi and 20 Evasion/Armor.
You're probably not learning TM from your enemies and are being eaten alive every time you try to move up. Here is a few easy steps to follow until you get a bit more experience and learn spells to mitigate he problem:
1) Do NOT Learn TM from a class. I find that if you do this, your TM will WAY outpace your defensive skills. Instead try and get an Evasion class.
2) Make sure to keep your experience pools full as often as possible with evasion and armor.
3) Accept the fact that you just need to spend more time FIGHTING and avoiding being hit and doing things in armor. To mitigate this, learn your magic and harness skill in combat and it won't be so boring.
Warrior Mages have very potent spells to make up for the Tert Armor/Survival learning curve, but you'll never get to use it if you give up.
<< End Original Post >>
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
Well the original poster suggested not listening to TM and INSTEAD listening to Evasion or Armor or some such. I think keeping our hard to learn but vitally necessary Tert skills learning as much as possible is a very good idea. Keep in mind this was probably targeted to guild sitters who are always after TM classes. I agree that if your gonna listen to a class on a regular basis listen to one that teaches a hard to learn skill not a primary one. In my oppinion that's just lazy.
<<I hope no one determines at level by their offenses. I consider at level being able to dance with 3.>>
I agree with you unfortunatly there are many who do nothing more than slaughter anything that enters a room as fast as they can. The hit and run specialist are easy to spot, they are the ones always complaining about our buff spells, complaining that prep times are too long, that spells should be easier to snap, that multi is to hard to learn and that we should have cool looking armor with no weight and no hinderance and protects like HP only better or else I'm leaning and taking all 3000 of my friends with MEEEEEEE!!104710479111
Legal Disclamer: If this does not apply to you assume I'm not talking to you and relax. No whiners were harmed during the making of this post.
Thoraxia the King of PC (oops king is male only, oh well)
PS and yes that was a general you not a specific one
Thoraxia said it. I feel that learning TM in a class is less efficient than learning a tert skill, especially evasion or armor.
I want to stress again that according to my way of thinking, keeping your defenses close to TM is extremely important for long term development and happiness. Woodcub, I appologize for singling you out, but your earlier post mentions the very reason why I use my strategy:
<<Luckily, the gap between my weapon, defeneses and target is slowly closing. Hopefully in another year, I can progress to a new hunting area that can provide me with optimal learning. I rarely lock target in my current area primarily because I'm reaching the caps, target wise. In fact, I don't even try to lock my target. As long as I'm in the learning or thoughtful range, I'm actually happy (for now). >>
<< My long term plan currently is backtraining, backtraining and more backtraining. I want my armor/defenses as close to my target as possible. So no, I won't ignore totally TM training, it's just not going to be a major priority for me (again . . for now.) >>
I believe that if one were to follow the strategy I laid out much earlier in the posts and have pasted below once more for those who might have missed it, a warrior mage can mostly avoid the backtraining paradox which seems to have become the norm for warrior mages while Elriic was on ice for 5 years.
<< Original Post and Elriic's Comments on Training Target and Warrior Maging in General: >>
Warrior Mages are Tert Survival (Evasion) and Tert Armor (Armor). What that means is that a typical warrior mage at circle 10 most likely will be at 40 TM, 30 Parry/Multi and 20 Evasion/Armor.
You're probably not learning TM from your enemies and are being eaten alive every time you try to move up. Here is a few easy steps to follow until you get a bit more experience and learn spells to mitigate he problem:
1) Do NOT Learn TM from a class. I find that if you do this, your TM will WAY outpace your defensive skills. Instead try and get an Evasion class.
2) Make sure to keep your experience pools full as often as possible with evasion and armor.
3) Accept the fact that you just need to spend more time FIGHTING and avoiding being hit and doing things in armor. To mitigate this, learn your magic and harness skill in combat and it won't be so boring.
Warrior Mages have very potent spells to make up for the Tert Armor/Survival learning curve, but you'll never get to use it if you give up.
<< End Original Post >>
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
<<Yeah- what Nester said I said.....
And what kind of warmie board is this? I haven't been flamed once for my comments! Everyone is being so civil I feel like rerolling....>>
Horrid isn't it? Someone replaced them all with fluffy pink bunnies.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
Yeah Well... If I don't behave myself, Cecco's gonna come and whomp me over the head with a hidden post stick. Been down that road too many times in the last few months :P
On another note, Chakram, I was wondering if you could answer an earlier post I had written regarding experience and aimed body part shots. Is it true that if you aim for a body part and miss the roll that you whiff the target completely 100% of the time?
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
And what kind of warmie board is this? I haven't been flamed once for my comments! Everyone is being so civil I feel like rerolling....>>
Horrid isn't it? Someone replaced them all with fluffy pink bunnies.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
Yeah Well... If I don't behave myself, Cecco's gonna come and whomp me over the head with a hidden post stick. Been down that road too many times in the last few months :P
On another note, Chakram, I was wondering if you could answer an earlier post I had written regarding experience and aimed body part shots. Is it true that if you aim for a body part and miss the roll that you whiff the target completely 100% of the time?
Elriic Melnebone
~For the Balance!
~I have returned!
<<On another note, Chakram, I was wondering if you could answer an earlier post I had written regarding experience and aimed body part shots. Is it true that if you aim for a body part and miss the roll that you whiff the target completely 100% of the time?>>
I don't believe so, at least the results I got didn't seem like this was the case.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
I don't believe so, at least the results I got didn't seem like this was the case.
-Chakram
"It's a shame they let the old punishments die out....God I miss the screaming."
>I wanted to weigh in on this issue. Nester I would agree with you except for one thing. You're not factoring player enjoyment into the situation. Most players I know don't enjoy staying in the same critter for what seems like forever and most do not like to hunt while learning only one or two skills. I know I don't. I also don't like retreating all the time or having to load up on SW,YS, SUF,ES at all times just to stay alive as I train. In the earlier thread I agree that character A has more raw power but I argue that character B will enjoy Dragonrealms more, die less and probably complain less about being survival tert. Let's face it it's no fun to die as soon as something get's to melee.
Guess what? You misunderstood too.
Nester
Guess what? You misunderstood too.
Nester
