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I would like to offer a suggestion that would aid those new arriving players that would like play the pure professions.
It is a simple task for veteran players to use the 30 day window of instant migration to equip a wizard and take a claidhmore and develop that character within that 30 days into a soneone who can then use magic effectively. While it is certainly do able I think it would be better if a wizard could hunt effectively out of the gate with magic.
If I were new to the game and I wanted to play a wizard and cast spells I would not to necessarily swing a weapon for X amount of time before I could do that.
A new player, whether F2P or not, should be able to use magic to hunt with magic without having to resort to using weapons in my opinion. There has to be a way to achieve this.
Wolfloner's player
Steve
My advice to new wizards is always the same:
The treasure system is spitting out all of those wands for a reason. Don't be afraid to use them.
Though I suppose it might be nice if the newbie starting gear had a handful of iron wands instead of just the one.
Signed,
Raelee and her Strings
>Speaking to Zyllah, Alyias says, "See? Raelee knows all."
The treasure system is spitting out all of those wands for a reason. Don't be afraid to use them.
Though I suppose it might be nice if the newbie starting gear had a handful of iron wands instead of just the one.
Signed,
Raelee and her Strings
>Speaking to Zyllah, Alyias says, "See? Raelee knows all."
Just yesterday, a new player created a sorcerer and quickly gave up on the class because mana was too limiting.
If it's too much of a mechanics shift to change mana pools, how about an NPC who hands out wands for low-level characters? Free silver wands don't seem any more unbalanced than having a claidhmore, and feel more appropriate from an RP perspective.
These wands would be specially designed for new characters, and should be:
* Not sellable
* Have no MIU requirement
* Only usable up to level 10 (Probably a decent stopping point for all but Empaths? But they can transfer all wounds by 10 so it may be fine.)
* Limited on how many you can have at a time (or you get only one, but the NPC can recharge it for free)
If it's too much of a mechanics shift to change mana pools, how about an NPC who hands out wands for low-level characters? Free silver wands don't seem any more unbalanced than having a claidhmore, and feel more appropriate from an RP perspective.
These wands would be specially designed for new characters, and should be:
* Not sellable
* Have no MIU requirement
* Only usable up to level 10 (Probably a decent stopping point for all but Empaths? But they can transfer all wounds by 10 so it may be fine.)
* Limited on how many you can have at a time (or you get only one, but the NPC can recharge it for free)
Maybe we could create a group that delivers "care-packages". Personally, I get a cheap bag and fill it with basic herbs, wands, a small statue and blessed dagger for my Alts. All of my characters have them in their lockers for bad days. (In RR, saving up cash for satchel pretty much makes you a citizen in short order.)
Maybe a bunch of us can plan a pair of monthly events for F2P players. The first would be for us to gather the components in the bags and another to hand them out. Basically, locker cleaning for many of us GS life-ers. :)
Now, was I reading correctly? Is DR having it's own F2P events? Is there any plan or call to have the other games have the same format? I would imagine that it was hard enough to get two games to do this, but I want to go back to the other worlds I visited in The Time Before Interwebs.
Many years ago, I recall playing MO, DR, and perhaps AoH (was this the Hercules game?). Was there a give-away when we hit the web, a trail period for each or a package deal? Perhaps I am simply remembering the AOL days, but the only recollection I have of that was the crack-like GSIII splash screen. I distinctly remember entering a town on moving wagon and being very impressed.
Magarven the Mad
Maybe a bunch of us can plan a pair of monthly events for F2P players. The first would be for us to gather the components in the bags and another to hand them out. Basically, locker cleaning for many of us GS life-ers. :)
Now, was I reading correctly? Is DR having it's own F2P events? Is there any plan or call to have the other games have the same format? I would imagine that it was hard enough to get two games to do this, but I want to go back to the other worlds I visited in The Time Before Interwebs.
Many years ago, I recall playing MO, DR, and perhaps AoH (was this the Hercules game?). Was there a give-away when we hit the web, a trail period for each or a package deal? Perhaps I am simply remembering the AOL days, but the only recollection I have of that was the crack-like GSIII splash screen. I distinctly remember entering a town on moving wagon and being very impressed.
Magarven the Mad
Double starting mana, done. Handing out free wands is just an overly complex process that is not needed when a simple solution is available. You will be hard pressed to convince me at this stage in the game that giving everyone an additional ~10 mana is going to break anything.
Keith/Brinret/Shiun
Brinret says, "Bring it on."
A bolt of lightning streaks down from the sky and strikes Brinret!
... 16428101 points of damage!
Powerful blast reduces Brinret to a smoldering pile of ash!
Keith/Brinret/Shiun
Brinret says, "Bring it on."
A bolt of lightning streaks down from the sky and strikes Brinret!
... 16428101 points of damage!
Powerful blast reduces Brinret to a smoldering pile of ash!
Another solution would be to find a high level ranger to make tons of blank rods and imbed them with 901. If the ranger can max out the mana in the rod, it'll hold at least 80 charges + a few more if the ranger has lore. Then just stack them somewhere for easy access.
Way better than crappy low-charge silver/iron wands.
~Brian, Sepher's player
Way better than crappy low-charge silver/iron wands.
~Brian, Sepher's player
>Double starting mana, done. Handing out free wands is just an overly complex process that is not needed when a simple solution is available. You will be hard pressed to convince me at this stage in the game that giving everyone an additional ~10 mana is going to break anything.
~10 mana is only about 2 or 3 kills though, and it depends on how the player set their stats. Even the other suggestions like recovery enhancives and more (but still limited) wands still run into limitations. Why not let low-level pures have effectively unlimited mana for attacking?
~10 mana is only about 2 or 3 kills though, and it depends on how the player set their stats. Even the other suggestions like recovery enhancives and more (but still limited) wands still run into limitations. Why not let low-level pures have effectively unlimited mana for attacking?
>Just yesterday, a new player created a sorcerer and quickly gave up on the class because mana was too limiting.
the force is not strong with impatient people. While I agree a flat +10 to mana at character gen would go a long way, the ranger rod solution is the best for what we have right now. If someone is unwilling to do one small step, there's not much anyone can do to help them and I don't think these people should be catered to.
The fact that the standard starting build for any pure is "grab a claid" makes it obvious that there is an underlying issue with low level pures. This should be addressed before opening F2P accounts.
Keith/Brinret/Shiun
Brinret says, "Bring it on."
A bolt of lightning streaks down from the sky and strikes Brinret!
... 16428101 points of damage!
Powerful blast reduces Brinret to a smoldering pile of ash!
Keith/Brinret/Shiun
Brinret says, "Bring it on."
A bolt of lightning streaks down from the sky and strikes Brinret!
... 16428101 points of damage!
Powerful blast reduces Brinret to a smoldering pile of ash!
I like the discussion, and it's something I've been wondering at, myself.
There's an important point that I don't see getting air time, though -- a part of the lower levels is supposed to be indoctrination to managing one's assets. I think it's a critical part for the first time player. It obviously quickly builds to a limiting factor for the returning player whose been through it a time or twenty, true.
But how can we use these suggestions and retain that important facet for the first time player? I agree with Keith (and others) that something needs to be done, but I also agree with Vanessa (and others) that doing too much doesn't set the right tone.
Doug
There's an important point that I don't see getting air time, though -- a part of the lower levels is supposed to be indoctrination to managing one's assets. I think it's a critical part for the first time player. It obviously quickly builds to a limiting factor for the returning player whose been through it a time or twenty, true.
But how can we use these suggestions and retain that important facet for the first time player? I agree with Keith (and others) that something needs to be done, but I also agree with Vanessa (and others) that doing too much doesn't set the right tone.
Doug
I wonder if it would be possible to give bonuses for group hunting when the chars are not from the same household. I say household because who is to say I can't make an account and claim, that's my daughter and we always just hunt together. While this may be true, there is no way to prove it.
I am of the belief that when we rely on other players rather than our own pocket accounts, the game is more alive and GS is better for it. Does that mean that sometimes we the players have less convenience? Sure. But the trade of is the chance to create unique RP and for a game that is first and foremost a RP game that seems like a good thing.
I'd love to get a tiny exp bonus for using player services. I mean the players who perform the services get experience for doing so, but what is there really to encourage players to seek out those player services?
From a management prospective I can see where this would be tricky, but might be manageable through some sort of roles and permissions based modifier.
"Names! The choices are so limited. So many good names seem to be taken but not used. A name can make or break a character in my humble opinion. It took a long time for me to find a name I was happy with when I started last month. Is it possible there might be some kind of purge to free up names for an influx of new players?"
If I'm not mistaken, they actually did a purge a few years ago, not sure how that turned out, or if it was even done, but I remember a post on the main site stating that some sort of purge was going to be done to get rid of inactive accounts. Not sure if the names were purged or if they only did the accounts. I was deployed at the time and never got to see an update on it.
~Rayna, cleric of Oleani and Ta'Vaalor
If I'm not mistaken, they actually did a purge a few years ago, not sure how that turned out, or if it was even done, but I remember a post on the main site stating that some sort of purge was going to be done to get rid of inactive accounts. Not sure if the names were purged or if they only did the accounts. I was deployed at the time and never got to see an update on it.
~Rayna, cleric of Oleani and Ta'Vaalor
>Just yesterday, a new player created a sorcerer and quickly gave up on the class because mana was too limiting.
Just yesterday, I was testing a level 1 sorcerer for gswiki. They must be doing something wrong.
"What Kaldonis does on his off time is totally Kaldonis's business, dude." ~Scribes
Just yesterday, I was testing a level 1 sorcerer for gswiki. They must be doing something wrong.
"What Kaldonis does on his off time is totally Kaldonis's business, dude." ~Scribes
Not in any way at all opposed to helping out starting pures.
Still, by putting my mana stats at 100, and over-training Harness Power, I had like 24 mana at level 1. It was more than enough to Blood Burst some rats and get fried. Granted, sitting around while rats bleed to death isn't the most entertaining thing I've done in recent years, but it is what it is. The fact that my test-case was a dark elf might skew the "normal" situation as far as the precise CS I had.
I only got about 2 hours into playing that character (something else came up). I didn't bother training in mana controls to try bumping my mana regeneration rate.
Once I play through the early levels as a pure pure (it has probably been a decade or more since I did that) I'll have a better idea. I felt it was a good idea to force myself to do this for the beginner's guide I helped author, to make sure we give all the correct advice.
Definitely want to experience this myself, and then I'll surely have a better idea than my limited imagination concerning the situation! Of course, that'll only be for a sorcerer, and won't tell me too much about wizards, empaths, or clerics.
My first main character was a pacifist cleric. And idea how long it takes to level like that, using the janky old 301 and Repel Undead? It was pretty rough the first 5 levels killing lesser shades under the temple (or whatever they are called) that wear metal breastplate or something.
One total aside which I wonder how F2P may will affect. After hitting level 12 (when 312 was still a raising dead spell), I got to level 30 almost solely by raising at the North Gate (when that was the only Spirit Guide target). It would be pretty awesome if the Lands were populated enough once again for locksmiths, healing empaths, and raising clerics to really go that route for their prime sources of experience. (Some people might manage it, but it used to be loads of people did that quite easily. We used to have several clerics at the North Gate and rotate order.)
For clerics, this won't work for the early levels these days. Empaths, however...
"What Kaldonis does on his off time is totally Kaldonis's business, dude." ~Scribes
Still, by putting my mana stats at 100, and over-training Harness Power, I had like 24 mana at level 1. It was more than enough to Blood Burst some rats and get fried. Granted, sitting around while rats bleed to death isn't the most entertaining thing I've done in recent years, but it is what it is. The fact that my test-case was a dark elf might skew the "normal" situation as far as the precise CS I had.
I only got about 2 hours into playing that character (something else came up). I didn't bother training in mana controls to try bumping my mana regeneration rate.
Once I play through the early levels as a pure pure (it has probably been a decade or more since I did that) I'll have a better idea. I felt it was a good idea to force myself to do this for the beginner's guide I helped author, to make sure we give all the correct advice.
Definitely want to experience this myself, and then I'll surely have a better idea than my limited imagination concerning the situation! Of course, that'll only be for a sorcerer, and won't tell me too much about wizards, empaths, or clerics.
My first main character was a pacifist cleric. And idea how long it takes to level like that, using the janky old 301 and Repel Undead? It was pretty rough the first 5 levels killing lesser shades under the temple (or whatever they are called) that wear metal breastplate or something.
One total aside which I wonder how F2P may will affect. After hitting level 12 (when 312 was still a raising dead spell), I got to level 30 almost solely by raising at the North Gate (when that was the only Spirit Guide target). It would be pretty awesome if the Lands were populated enough once again for locksmiths, healing empaths, and raising clerics to really go that route for their prime sources of experience. (Some people might manage it, but it used to be loads of people did that quite easily. We used to have several clerics at the North Gate and rotate order.)
For clerics, this won't work for the early levels these days. Empaths, however...
"What Kaldonis does on his off time is totally Kaldonis's business, dude." ~Scribes
<<I'd actually like to do this and then double the mana regen rate up to a certain level and then have it taper off slowly to the "normal" rate. Casters gotta cast.>> - Solomon
Way, way long ago I would have resisted this, but these days I think we can soften up.
+1
- Xorus' player
>look parchment
Written across the parchment is the phrase:
You will one day sit, and die, upon a throne....of chocolate.
Way, way long ago I would have resisted this, but these days I think we can soften up.
+1
- Xorus' player
>look parchment
Written across the parchment is the phrase:
You will one day sit, and die, upon a throne....of chocolate.
>> A new player, whether F2P or not, should be able to use magic to hunt with magic without having to resort to using weapons in my opinion. There has to be a way to achieve this.
This has always bugged me as a player. The inability of pures to effectively hunt as a caster at starting levels. The idea I most favor at present would be to introduce zero level spells for pure classes. Starting wizard, cast fire spark (0 mana cost, about half as effective as 901), starting empath, cast aching bones (0 mana cost, significantly reduced version of bone shatter), and so forth. Maybe once you achieve a certain level (15th or 20th level) the spell becomes slightly more effective and costs 1 mana to cast from then on.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
This has always bugged me as a player. The inability of pures to effectively hunt as a caster at starting levels. The idea I most favor at present would be to introduce zero level spells for pure classes. Starting wizard, cast fire spark (0 mana cost, about half as effective as 901), starting empath, cast aching bones (0 mana cost, significantly reduced version of bone shatter), and so forth. Maybe once you achieve a certain level (15th or 20th level) the spell becomes slightly more effective and costs 1 mana to cast from then on.
-- Robert
"Wyrom isn't interacting with me, I think he is AFK scripting."
I've always like the idea of making mana equal to your Harness Power skill bonus... thus, if you have 5 ranks in Harness power, you have 25 mana... 10 ranks, 50 mana, etc. etc. With the way skill to skill-bonus works, it'd be a diminishing return ofter a certian number of ranks, but for the first dozen or three ranks, it'd be a huge boost to the mana pool.
