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At what point can a Ranger start hunting these guys? Skinning required? Ranged skill? Hiding? Any info would be great.
-Morgar
I can kill them pretty easily with just under 400 in ME. I would say defenses, you would want a minimum of 500. With over 600 in defenses and 93 reflex, I still don't trust them without casting SOTT and SOP. Around 600 stealth, they still spot me sometimes when I hide at melee. Honestly, they are not really ranger friendly. I believe the spells they cast are static discharge and tingle. And if you hit them with a metal weapon, wince. I like them, because they are close to leth where I can train boxes and escaping pretty easily.
Asterid
Also, please remember to watch the conflicts ~Sidatura
Asterid
Also, please remember to watch the conflicts ~Sidatura
I love them, except for when Asterid (or any other hunter) is in there, then the spawn goes from awesome to non-existent. I emailed back and forth with feedback about this, and it's intended that these critters not be useful for training multiple characters in there at the same time. Though why that is the case is beyond my comprehension. I agree with the previous assessments on minimum skill level. I wouldn't go near them with less than 550 myself since any hit is likely to result in a stun and internal bleeders (mostly impact damage).
Honestly, you're trading the hassle/isolation of celps for another set of problems.
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
Honestly, you're trading the hassle/isolation of celps for another set of problems.
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
Ultimately the storm bull area is "owned" by one specific GM, whom I understand has the final say on things like spawn. So if they decide the area isn't to be swarmy, it isn't.
The storm bull area originally genned something really low like 2, which was later changed to like 2.5 per hunter or something. Which is slow to ok spawn if everyone there is actively killing, and absolutely terrible if anyone decides to dance at the engagement cap.
This goes back to the fact that spawn mechanics are overly simplistic, and the only area where spawn isn't an issue is where it's set very high, like super celpeze.
Unrelated, but if you're premie or have a premie friend you might want to check out the new frogs SE of leth. I understand they teach a bit over 400 but I'm not sure how high exactly. And the upper branches all have independent spawn zones, so you can't get screwed by the other hunters.
The storm bull area originally genned something really low like 2, which was later changed to like 2.5 per hunter or something. Which is slow to ok spawn if everyone there is actively killing, and absolutely terrible if anyone decides to dance at the engagement cap.
This goes back to the fact that spawn mechanics are overly simplistic, and the only area where spawn isn't an issue is where it's set very high, like super celpeze.
Unrelated, but if you're premie or have a premie friend you might want to check out the new frogs SE of leth. I understand they teach a bit over 400 but I'm not sure how high exactly. And the upper branches all have independent spawn zones, so you can't get screwed by the other hunters.
> The storm bull area originally genned something really low like 2, which was later changed to like 2.5 per hunter or something. Which is slow to ok spawn if everyone there is actively killing, and absolutely terrible if anyone decides to dance at the engagement cap.
It's currently set to spawn 5 bulls, independent of the number of hunters in the area. So that works out great for a solo hunter, but is practically unworkable for multiple hunters given the size of the area (~20 rooms).
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
It's currently set to spawn 5 bulls, independent of the number of hunters in the area. So that works out great for a solo hunter, but is practically unworkable for multiple hunters given the size of the area (~20 rooms).
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
<< I emailed back and forth with feedback about this, and it's intended that these critters not be useful for training multiple characters in there at the same time. >>
That would only be okay if there were numerous alternative creatures one could use instead. That, however, is about as far from the case as possible...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Thanks,
-Death's Nemesis Karthor
That would only be okay if there were numerous alternative creatures one could use instead. That, however, is about as far from the case as possible...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Thanks,
-Death's Nemesis Karthor
>That would only be okay if there were numerous alternative creatures one could use instead. That, however, is about as far from the case as possible...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Warklins, too.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
Warklins, too.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
>>and it's intended that these critters not be useful for training multiple characters in there at the same time.
Yeah that's the lamest thing I have ever heard.
>>...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Ugh, that was going to be one of my future hunting spots, hopefully it gets fixed before I get that far :/
Vote DR as TOP MUD: http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-cemm.html
Yeah that's the lamest thing I have ever heard.
>>...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Ugh, that was going to be one of my future hunting spots, hopefully it gets fixed before I get that far :/
Vote DR as TOP MUD: http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-cemm.html
>>and it's intended that these critters not be useful for training multiple characters in there at the same time.
Yeah that's the lamest thing I have ever heard.>>>
Yes, I agree. Sorry Hanryu, and anyone else hunting storm bulls. I had no idea.
>>...I had to leave sky giants today because the same friggin' thing happens there.
Ugh, that was going to be one of my future hunting spots, hopefully it gets fixed before I get that far :/>>>
Again, this sucks. I've popped in there from time to time, and not the best, limiting it to one hunter sucks. Hope it gets fixed.
Asterid
Also, please remember to watch the conflicts ~Sidatura
> Hope it gets fixed.
Doubtful. Here's some relevant quotes from my email exchanges:
*Spread out to where exactly? Mriss I guess. Furthermore it's not just storm bulls. Shalswar, giants, and basilisks (and I'm sure other critters) also suffer from this idiotic "5 spawn no matter how many hunters there are", mechanic.
The real issue is the way spawn is determined in the first place. I can only hope that the current spawn mechanics are thrown out during the combat rewrite. Furthermore the policies that allow individual province GMs sole control over critter spawn need to be reevaluated.
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
Doubtful. Here's some relevant quotes from my email exchanges:
| The gen rate in the area is deliberately a little on the slow side |
| Basically, it's working right. It may not be working the way people would like so much, but that's a different thing from it working the way it's supposed to |
| The short version though is, the spawn rates in some places are not all that high, deliberately. Part of that is to get people to spread out*, part other things, but they're working as planned. |
*Spread out to where exactly? Mriss I guess. Furthermore it's not just storm bulls. Shalswar, giants, and basilisks (and I'm sure other critters) also suffer from this idiotic "5 spawn no matter how many hunters there are", mechanic.
The real issue is the way spawn is determined in the first place. I can only hope that the current spawn mechanics are thrown out during the combat rewrite. Furthermore the policies that allow individual province GMs sole control over critter spawn need to be reevaluated.
~Hunter Hanryu
http://drplat.com/CombatEquipmentCompendium.xls
http://tinyurl.com/HanryuTanning
<< The short version though is, the spawn rates in some places are not all that high, deliberately. Part of that is to get people to spread out*, part other things, but they're working as planned. >>
That really makes no sense reguarding storm bulls, that general area has almost zero people around as it is, if you want people to spread out then a place like Ilaya Taipa needs to have hunting that encourages people to come there. Poor spawn just encourages the almost nil population to continue to be so.
That really makes no sense reguarding storm bulls, that general area has almost zero people around as it is, if you want people to spread out then a place like Ilaya Taipa needs to have hunting that encourages people to come there. Poor spawn just encourages the almost nil population to continue to be so.
>>if you want people to spread out then a place like Ilaya Taipa needs to have hunting that encourages people to come there. Poor spawn just encourages the almost nil population to continue to be so. <<
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
>that general area has almost zero people around as it is, if you want people to spread out then a place like Ilaya Taipa needs to have hunting that encourages people to come there. Poor spawn just encourages the almost nil population to continue to be so.
lolparadox
"We'll encourage people to spread out by only providing one critter per combat range that spawns well! Yeah, that's the ticket!"
Warklins is 7 always (4 armored warlkins, 3 warklin maulers) and they're supposed to teach to ~550 but you need four to move MO off clear at 442. It's pretty much unhuntable when someone else is in their AFK scripting stealths... just for example. I'm about to try shadow beasts to see if that can keep me off Ratha. Spread out indeed.
>The real issue is the way spawn is determined in the first place. I can only hope that the current spawn mechanics are thrown out during the combat rewrite. Furthermore the policies that allow individual province GMs sole control over critter spawn need to be reevaluated.
Completely agree with the first part, but the second actually makes sense. If a GM wants their province to be a ghost town, or only good for a certain small range of characters, that's part of the perk of being in charge.
The problem is this:
Players want to have hunting from 0 - 2000 in every province so they can stay in the town they enjoy being from and roleplaying in.
The game is intentionally designed to make this impossible.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
lolparadox
"We'll encourage people to spread out by only providing one critter per combat range that spawns well! Yeah, that's the ticket!"
Warklins is 7 always (4 armored warlkins, 3 warklin maulers) and they're supposed to teach to ~550 but you need four to move MO off clear at 442. It's pretty much unhuntable when someone else is in their AFK scripting stealths... just for example. I'm about to try shadow beasts to see if that can keep me off Ratha. Spread out indeed.
>The real issue is the way spawn is determined in the first place. I can only hope that the current spawn mechanics are thrown out during the combat rewrite. Furthermore the policies that allow individual province GMs sole control over critter spawn need to be reevaluated.
Completely agree with the first part, but the second actually makes sense. If a GM wants their province to be a ghost town, or only good for a certain small range of characters, that's part of the perk of being in charge.
The problem is this:
Players want to have hunting from 0 - 2000 in every province so they can stay in the town they enjoy being from and roleplaying in.
The game is intentionally designed to make this impossible.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
>>The game is intentionally designed to make this impossible.<<
It was. I think that philosophy has changed, but it takes some time for that change to translate into development.
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
It was. I think that philosophy has changed, but it takes some time for that change to translate into development.
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
>That really makes no sense reguarding storm bulls, that general area has almost zero people around as it is, if you want people to spread out then a place like Ilaya Taipa needs to have hunting that encourages people to come there. Poor spawn just encourages the almost nil population to continue to be so.
Yeah, neither Leth nor Ilaya have any real draw that keeps people around.
Yeah, neither Leth nor Ilaya have any real draw that keeps people around.
>Players want to have hunting from 0 - 2000 in every province so they can stay in the town they enjoy being from and roleplaying in.
>The game is intentionally designed to make this impossible.
Could a GM please confirm if this is the case? To me this game is supposed to be fun. Its very clear there is a group of players (myself included) who wish to stay in a particular province and instead are forced to the isolation of Mer Kresh to fight over 5 hunting rooms in super celps which is not fun, its boring.
If critters that are like Super celps and above were added to each province, players would be happy and there would't be the issue of one province being over crowded. I simply can't understand why this isn't being at least planned (and I have not heard this is being planned).
Again a comment from a GM on this subject would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.
Felicini
>The game is intentionally designed to make this impossible.
Could a GM please confirm if this is the case? To me this game is supposed to be fun. Its very clear there is a group of players (myself included) who wish to stay in a particular province and instead are forced to the isolation of Mer Kresh to fight over 5 hunting rooms in super celps which is not fun, its boring.
If critters that are like Super celps and above were added to each province, players would be happy and there would't be the issue of one province being over crowded. I simply can't understand why this isn't being at least planned (and I have not heard this is being planned).
Again a comment from a GM on this subject would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.
Felicini
I don't think this is necessarily dictated from the top-down, but who knows. Jaedren recently said he would never allow super celpeze in the Crossing, but it was unclear if he was referring to the lizards specifically or high level creatures in general. He chose not to clarify.
Also, last time this came up for discussion on a large scale, people overwhelmingly voted for more low and mid level dev. So it's no surprise that top level hunting options are limited. I think people are a little short sighted on this topic, but as a TF player I realize that my opinion on this topic isn't really considered.
Also, last time this came up for discussion on a large scale, people overwhelmingly voted for more low and mid level dev. So it's no surprise that top level hunting options are limited. I think people are a little short sighted on this topic, but as a TF player I realize that my opinion on this topic isn't really considered.
>>I think people are a little short sighted on this topic, but as a TF player I realize that my opinion on this topic isn't really considered. <<
The big bulge of characters percolating up through Celpeze, Apes, etc suggests people are being short-sighted.
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
The big bulge of characters percolating up through Celpeze, Apes, etc suggests people are being short-sighted.
- Mazrian
The Flying Company
The Public Stat Data Project
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkqoUyrmvlKNdGlpeHZacEdldi1Ob2h3M1I5TXpCZVE&hl=en
<<If critters that are like Super celps and above were added to each province, players would be happy and there wouldn't be the issue of one province being over crowded.
This. People wouldn't be forced to be in one place for training reason, but would spread out due to RP reasons. If you get bored with a place you just pick up and move to that place. Training wouldn't be an issue.
Player of Drevid and Jhaval
http://www.phiiskeep.homestead.com/Barbarian.html
Cylons... why debugging matters.
This. People wouldn't be forced to be in one place for training reason, but would spread out due to RP reasons. If you get bored with a place you just pick up and move to that place. Training wouldn't be an issue.
Player of Drevid and Jhaval
http://www.phiiskeep.homestead.com/Barbarian.html
Cylons... why debugging matters.
>people overwhelmingly voted for more low and mid level dev. So it's no surprise that top level hunting options are limited.
This range is more developed than people seem to realize, as evidenced by questions of what to hunt between 40-140 ranks being THE most frequently asked question on the board. It's not as though there is a lack of answers, though.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
This range is more developed than people seem to realize, as evidenced by questions of what to hunt between 40-140 ranks being THE most frequently asked question on the board. It's not as though there is a lack of answers, though.
~ Kougen
Moon Mages: Ripping reality a new one since 586 BL
>>Furthermore it's not just storm bulls. Shalswar, giants, and basilisks (and I'm sure other critters) also suffer from this idiotic "5 spawn no matter how many hunters there are", mechanic.
I think you might be blaming that mechanic for all spawn-related troubles. Neither sky giants nor any Zaulfung creatures use it. Even if they did, it would be a perfectly valid design decision.
GM Grejuva
I think you might be blaming that mechanic for all spawn-related troubles. Neither sky giants nor any Zaulfung creatures use it. Even if they did, it would be a perfectly valid design decision.
GM Grejuva
>I think you might be blaming that mechanic for all spawn-related troubles. Neither sky giants nor any Zaulfung creatures use it. Even if they did, it would be a perfectly valid design decision.
I tend to like the mechanic, since in TF I often hunt alone. I'm not sure what you mean by valid design decision though. Any decision a GM has the authority to make is valid, but I don't see how that's relevant.
I tend to like the mechanic, since in TF I often hunt alone. I'm not sure what you mean by valid design decision though. Any decision a GM has the authority to make is valid, but I don't see how that's relevant.
<<Even if they did, it would be a perfectly valid design decision.
In the sense that the designer determines the criteria for validity, perhaps.
However, in a game intended to be used by and entertain hundreds of players I'm not certain designing a whole area and a new creature that can only functionally be used by one character at a time is an effective use of development resources. Nor does it seem to create any desirable incentives or behavior among the player base that benefits the game as a whole.
It does, however, encourage complaining about the design here on the boards while wasting an opportunity to fill a mainland hunting niche in an otherwise underused area (which also took considerable resources to construct). If these are the design goals, then indeed such areas are in fact perfectly valid design decisions.
You suddenly feel nauseous, as if you'd been doing performance art.
In the sense that the designer determines the criteria for validity, perhaps.
However, in a game intended to be used by and entertain hundreds of players I'm not certain designing a whole area and a new creature that can only functionally be used by one character at a time is an effective use of development resources. Nor does it seem to create any desirable incentives or behavior among the player base that benefits the game as a whole.
It does, however, encourage complaining about the design here on the boards while wasting an opportunity to fill a mainland hunting niche in an otherwise underused area (which also took considerable resources to construct). If these are the design goals, then indeed such areas are in fact perfectly valid design decisions.
You suddenly feel nauseous, as if you'd been doing performance art.
As a Barbarian-primary character, more high spawn = awesome.
You need to commit a one-man genocide to keep your combats moving decently in some of the combat-heavy guilds. I'm not even high-level and I have already found my hunting options limited sometimes by spawn mechanics. I imagine the problem will only exacerbate as creature choices become fewer and teach over longer ranges.
"Limited in nature yet infinite in desire - men are like fallen gods."
- Alphonse de Lamartine
You need to commit a one-man genocide to keep your combats moving decently in some of the combat-heavy guilds. I'm not even high-level and I have already found my hunting options limited sometimes by spawn mechanics. I imagine the problem will only exacerbate as creature choices become fewer and teach over longer ranges.
"Limited in nature yet infinite in desire - men are like fallen gods."
- Alphonse de Lamartine
I'm really not sure how you can consider a WM a non-combat guild. Tough (not impossible, but tough!) to get TM outside of combat.
But I'd agree. The current spawn mechanics with numerous creatures throughout DR, from the low end all the way to the top, need to be looked at.
four hours of hunting firecats, just to see two muscular firecats? It's...quite frustrating, to say the least.
“We few, we happy few, we band of brothers. For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother..."
~William Shakespeare
No Ranger Stands Alone
But I'd agree. The current spawn mechanics with numerous creatures throughout DR, from the low end all the way to the top, need to be looked at.
four hours of hunting firecats, just to see two muscular firecats? It's...quite frustrating, to say the least.
“We few, we happy few, we band of brothers. For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother..."
~William Shakespeare
No Ranger Stands Alone
<<four hours of hunting firecats, just to see two muscular firecats? It's...quite frustrating, to say the least.
I suspect the gen on those specifically was set low for acompletely different reason.
Nikpack
The gods are jerks. No, really.
-Armifer
I don't think we ever take the training wheels off as players or gamemasters.
-Inauri
I suspect the gen on those specifically was set low for acompletely different reason.
Nikpack
The gods are jerks. No, really.
-Armifer
I don't think we ever take the training wheels off as players or gamemasters.
-Inauri
While I agree, it probably was set low for a reason...THAT low is a bit atrocious, I think. I don't think I've ever seen another hunter up there.
“We few, we happy few, we band of brothers. For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother..."
~William Shakespeare
No Ranger Stands Alone
“We few, we happy few, we band of brothers. For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother..."
~William Shakespeare
No Ranger Stands Alone
It would be fine to have a bunch of slow-spawning 'rare' critters useful primarily in tanning or various other systems but not intended to be used for regular hunting IF we had a fully developed critter ladder.
We aren't quite there yet, so the focus should be on filling that out, even if that means upping the spawn of some critters.
That is my opinion.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
We aren't quite there yet, so the focus should be on filling that out, even if that means upping the spawn of some critters.
That is my opinion.
"That's how I knew who you were. You were always like "Blah blah blah I'm a Barbarian oh-my-god." -my gf
