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I know one of the stated goals of 3.0 was to make back training less of a pain in the ass. I feel a rather simple solution would be to allow any weapon to be trained even if its a complete fail. I.E. if I take 30 ranks of slings into celps for example I can get it moving and learn the weapon even though I'm 100% missing and not coming close. To be that would make back training much less a pain in the ass. I'm not sure the GMs want it to be THAT easy though. Just a thought...
The technique of the Banshee's Wail flows fluidly through your mind an instant before you unleash its power through a roar of fatal intent.
Raesh appears to be frozen with fear!
Roundtime: 2 sec.
- Buuwl
>That would kind of take away from the use of mastery.
Then we can remove the mastery skills. Less skills learned simultaneously in combat! But then we can't enjoy the boost in weapon usage from the mastery skill while using a less skilled weapon which to me is the real point of the mastery skills. I assume they're gonna leave things as are.
-Rixie
Then we can remove the mastery skills. Less skills learned simultaneously in combat! But then we can't enjoy the boost in weapon usage from the mastery skill while using a less skilled weapon which to me is the real point of the mastery skills. I assume they're gonna leave things as are.
-Rixie
Mastery skills seem precisely constructed to reasonably let this goal be true. I'm not sure specifically how they will function, but what you just described, being able to start a weapon from scratch at a higher level critter and still learn from it, is exactly how mastery will work. Masteries are not meant to boost at level damage.
This is a good thing.
This is a good thing.
<<<Mastery skills seem precisely constructed to reasonably let this goal be true. I'm not sure specifically how they will function, but what you just described, being able to start a weapon from scratch at a higher level critter and still learn from it, is exactly how mastery will work. Masteries are not meant to boost at level damage.>>
My testing has shown masteries help... A little, but not much.
The technique of the Banshee's Wail flows fluidly through your mind an instant before you unleash its power through a roar of fatal intent.
Raesh appears to be frozen with fear!
Roundtime: 2 sec.
- Buuwl
My testing has shown masteries help... A little, but not much.
The technique of the Banshee's Wail flows fluidly through your mind an instant before you unleash its power through a roar of fatal intent.
Raesh appears to be frozen with fear!
Roundtime: 2 sec.
- Buuwl
My testing has shown masteries help... A little, but not much.
Just for information sake. here is what it is doing for me. I know it's no where near the skill level of those posting at the moment, but 289 ranks of Melee Mastery is allowing me to backtrain Polearms with 32 ranks in Red Brocket deer (2nd tier). Time to mindlock: ~12 minutes.
~The Prydaen~
Just for information sake. here is what it is doing for me. I know it's no where near the skill level of those posting at the moment, but 289 ranks of Melee Mastery is allowing me to backtrain Polearms with 32 ranks in Red Brocket deer (2nd tier). Time to mindlock: ~12 minutes.
~The Prydaen~
Just for information sake. here is what it is doing for me. I know it's no where near the skill level of those posting at the moment, but 289 ranks of Melee Mastery is allowing me to backtrain Polearms with 32 ranks in Red Brocket deer (2nd tier). Time to mindlock: ~12 minutes.<<
This sounds great except I train my lower weapons in the same area in prime with 60's in skill. so it does help but I think maybe it could use some more help tho.
>>This sounds great except I train my lower weapons in the same area in prime with 60's in skill. so it does help but I think maybe it could use some more help tho.
Yeah. My comment wasn't so much praise or complaint, nor vote for or against, as it was offering a data point.
~The Prydaen~
Yeah. My comment wasn't so much praise or complaint, nor vote for or against, as it was offering a data point.
~The Prydaen~
I just looked at my main prime character over in test. she's sitting at minus 630 TDPs. Tell me she won't have to backtrain to make that up, or seriously downgrade her stats by respecing? No thanks, even though her exp bonus pool is high. So until thieves are grandfathered up in magic, looks like I won't be playing prime once it hits over there.
Because the last time I logged her on in test she was gaining TDPs. Now all of a sudden she's so far in the negative????
if it weren't for my plat chars, if i had to deal with only that in prime, it would be hasta la vista, baby...
An arisen dummy zombie bellows, "You will all be ssslaughtered!"
>
Because the last time I logged her on in test she was gaining TDPs. Now all of a sudden she's so far in the negative????
if it weren't for my plat chars, if i had to deal with only that in prime, it would be hasta la vista, baby...
An arisen dummy zombie bellows, "You will all be ssslaughtered!"
>
Oh noes 600 TDPs negative?
> tdp
You have -1604 TDPs.
And I know I'm no where near the worst.
1\This is globally affecting people. Either take the TDP respec, or deal with the negative. There really is no good reason not to take the respec.
2\With the bonus pools it will take you next to no time to recoup those.
tl;dr: Suck it up like everyone else
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
> tdp
You have -1604 TDPs.
And I know I'm no where near the worst.
1\This is globally affecting people. Either take the TDP respec, or deal with the negative. There really is no good reason not to take the respec.
2\With the bonus pools it will take you next to no time to recoup those.
tl;dr: Suck it up like everyone else
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
>Out of curiosity, how is that happening?
Generally: Thieves get smacked the worst, Barbs and Traders not far behind, and Magic Primes the least (I would hazard Cleric/WM would get slightly less TDP debt abuse than MM). Everyone else is in between, depending on how they've trained their character over the life of the character.
1. What causes TDP debt is having a lot of skill combines. Thieves have long been REQUIRED to train a lot of skills that are being combined. They are REQUIRED to do hiding/stalking and lockpicking/disarming. They were expected to ignore (at least for the sake of requirements) survival skills that are not being combined (first aid, foraging, skinning). Barbs train a lot of weapon skills, but don't necessarily train skills that are being combined (Since a Barbarian could easily train 5 weapons and not have combined skills. In fact, if I was a Barbarian, I wouldn't, what with the B philosophy of "a bow, a blade, a blunt, brawling, and a blunt thrown").
2. What significantly decreases TDP debt is magic rank grandfathering (or any grandfathering really, but most other grandfathering is slight, because reqs don't change all THAT much, save Astro/Thana, and those are getting free grandfathering). If you had 500 ranks of PM in 2.0, then in 3.0 you will have 500 ranks of PM, 450 ranks of Augmentation, 400 ranks of Debilitation, 375 ranks of Utility, and 350 ranks of Debilitation. (I wish Socharis would let us move that, my MM and Empath could REALLY stand to have Utility in the 90% slot.)
3a. The general population of Traders get a small cushion because of getting grandfathered a ton (My Trader still loses something on the order of 1400 TDP AFTER grandfathering, because I don't get grandfathered a lot (mostly less than 20 ranks in a few things, except for Armor 1 and Survival 3, which get like 50 and 80 ranks or so, respectively, and I've trained a LOT of Vocals and Performing sub-skills. It's made up for that I will drop 20 Charisma points in the respec.)
3b. Barbarians get a similar cushion in that they will get magic ranks grandfathered to circle.
4. Thieves, if they get any grandfathering cushion, will be getting it in 6-8th survival (because of now needing survivals they didn't before and losing Escaping, a stealth skill, and a box skill), perhaps Weapon 1 (req went up a little).
It should be somewhat temporary, as Thieves and Traders will EVENTUALLY get magic ranks, and thus TDP.
And if you have TDP debt, you WILL have bonus pools to draw from. Yes, it sucks to lose a lot of TDP. But they will be gained back. And there is always RESPEC.
Kaeta Airtag
>>Actually an opinion cannot be changed or corrected. Nice try back of line.-VERATHOR
>>But it can be wrong.-Starlear
Generally: Thieves get smacked the worst, Barbs and Traders not far behind, and Magic Primes the least (I would hazard Cleric/WM would get slightly less TDP debt abuse than MM). Everyone else is in between, depending on how they've trained their character over the life of the character.
1. What causes TDP debt is having a lot of skill combines. Thieves have long been REQUIRED to train a lot of skills that are being combined. They are REQUIRED to do hiding/stalking and lockpicking/disarming. They were expected to ignore (at least for the sake of requirements) survival skills that are not being combined (first aid, foraging, skinning). Barbs train a lot of weapon skills, but don't necessarily train skills that are being combined (Since a Barbarian could easily train 5 weapons and not have combined skills. In fact, if I was a Barbarian, I wouldn't, what with the B philosophy of "a bow, a blade, a blunt, brawling, and a blunt thrown").
2. What significantly decreases TDP debt is magic rank grandfathering (or any grandfathering really, but most other grandfathering is slight, because reqs don't change all THAT much, save Astro/Thana, and those are getting free grandfathering). If you had 500 ranks of PM in 2.0, then in 3.0 you will have 500 ranks of PM, 450 ranks of Augmentation, 400 ranks of Debilitation, 375 ranks of Utility, and 350 ranks of Debilitation. (I wish Socharis would let us move that, my MM and Empath could REALLY stand to have Utility in the 90% slot.)
3a. The general population of Traders get a small cushion because of getting grandfathered a ton (My Trader still loses something on the order of 1400 TDP AFTER grandfathering, because I don't get grandfathered a lot (mostly less than 20 ranks in a few things, except for Armor 1 and Survival 3, which get like 50 and 80 ranks or so, respectively, and I've trained a LOT of Vocals and Performing sub-skills. It's made up for that I will drop 20 Charisma points in the respec.)
3b. Barbarians get a similar cushion in that they will get magic ranks grandfathered to circle.
4. Thieves, if they get any grandfathering cushion, will be getting it in 6-8th survival (because of now needing survivals they didn't before and losing Escaping, a stealth skill, and a box skill), perhaps Weapon 1 (req went up a little).
It should be somewhat temporary, as Thieves and Traders will EVENTUALLY get magic ranks, and thus TDP.
And if you have TDP debt, you WILL have bonus pools to draw from. Yes, it sucks to lose a lot of TDP. But they will be gained back. And there is always RESPEC.
Kaeta Airtag
>>Actually an opinion cannot be changed or corrected. Nice try back of line.-VERATHOR
>>But it can be wrong.-Starlear
<<they're still getting enormous bonus pools, which means they'll earn that back post haste, right? >>
not with the slow-down of combat they won't. my plat thief <where 3.0 has been out for awhile now> still has the following <and she is much smaller circle than my prime thief.
Your Armor pool could fill one empty skill to 67 ranks.
Your Weapon pool could fill one empty skill to 128 ranks.
Your Magic pool could fill one empty skill to 6 ranks.
Your Survival pool could fill 2 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 28 ranks.
Your Lore pool could fill one empty skill to 193 ranks.
my prime thief:
Your Armor pool could fill one empty skill to 113 ranks.
Your Weapon pool could fill 2 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 94 ranks.
Your Magic pool could fill one empty skill to 101 ranks.
Your Survival pool could fill 23 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 165 ranks.
Your Lore pool could fill 9 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 144 ranks.
An arisen dummy zombie bellows, "You will all be ssslaughtered!"
>
not with the slow-down of combat they won't. my plat thief <where 3.0 has been out for awhile now> still has the following <and she is much smaller circle than my prime thief.
Your Armor pool could fill one empty skill to 67 ranks.
Your Weapon pool could fill one empty skill to 128 ranks.
Your Magic pool could fill one empty skill to 6 ranks.
Your Survival pool could fill 2 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 28 ranks.
Your Lore pool could fill one empty skill to 193 ranks.
my prime thief:
Your Armor pool could fill one empty skill to 113 ranks.
Your Weapon pool could fill 2 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 94 ranks.
Your Magic pool could fill one empty skill to 101 ranks.
Your Survival pool could fill 23 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 165 ranks.
Your Lore pool could fill 9 empty skills to 200 ranks and one empty skill to 144 ranks.
An arisen dummy zombie bellows, "You will all be ssslaughtered!"
>
>>not with the slow-down of combat they won't.
Slower combat != slower exp gain
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
Slower combat != slower exp gain
When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
