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Does dying work if another player is the one causing the death blow? Maybe I'm misunderstanding the way this works, but I jabbed at someone who had just departed and so was at 99% vitality loss. I got a light hit which killed the person, but caused almost no damage to the body part. I thought that would be the kind of situation where the person would be dying and not dead.
Just to clarify, he was not previously in the dying state. I killed him then too. Additionally, the killing hit was a light hit with no kind of critical wound. Further, it was to his right leg, which is not even a vital body part. I hope light hits are not capable of dropping vitality past the dying stage.
I'm thinking that, not ONLY was a new dying system inserted, but ALSO a new way to deal with the "dying" state. Spells and transferring vitality or wounds seem to be too slow to react to such a fragile, critical state. Maybe there's also a new system similar to what paramedics use to bring them back from the brink. Maybe some good pounding on their chest, or mouth-to-mouth recuscitation is what's needed here! If that's the case, we'd need to do some experimenting with new verbs here. Maybe we can check the libraries around Elanthia, or ask some of the guild leaders and see what they suggest. Otherwise, it may take a whole lotta deaths and favors from volunteers to figure this out.
Kiriko Chiisana, Gnome Empath
Kiriko Chiisana, Gnome Empath
From my experimentation with dying, limited as it is, I have noticed that the body uses it all of its reserves in order to keep from dying outright. You may or may not have noticed, but dying totally draings your fatigue. It uses this fatigue to create a sort of 'buffer' vitality. The person I experimented dropped to 0 vitality, then when I touched them moments after they dropped, they had only 84% loss. It seems as if their fatigue, along with other factors, was expended to make this buffer. Further, when the person's dying time elapses, the buffer is taken back, with interest, which makes it essential to recover lost vitality and fatigue if at all possible. My experience with this is admittedly limited, so I'm not sure what happens in the event that health is not recovered.
So, if one has no fatigue (like right after dying) it is plausible to assume that they would be unable to enter the 'dying' state because they have no reserves. Either that, or the chances are remarkably slim.
Former Empath Shaunn
So, if one has no fatigue (like right after dying) it is plausible to assume that they would be unable to enter the 'dying' state because they have no reserves. Either that, or the chances are remarkably slim.
Former Empath Shaunn
>>Yeah just wanted to say...this whole new dying thing?
>>I don't get it.
In the past, if you took a hit that would've taken you past 0 "hit points" (I know DR doesn't use hit points, bear with me it's an analogy), you'd be dead.
Now you have a buffer. If you take a hit that takes you between 0 and -10 hit points, you are in a "dying" state where you are unconscious, but aren't yet dead. You can be rescued, tended, and you might live.
If you take hits that would bring you /below/ -10, you're dead just like you used to be.
There are other nuances (like if your head gets ripped off putting you at -5, you still die, since you can't be "dying" without a head, though apparently one can still post on the boards with no head...) but that's the meat of it.
From the empathic perspective, it helps because many people will be lingering longer -- and getting wounded worse because they're lingering -- than previously, and can be snatched from the jaws of death without actually dying. That means more people living through terrible injuries that might've killed them before. Since they're not dead, they don't depart, and instead come to -- you guessed it! -- their friendly neighborhood empath for healing.
~ Nutawa
P.S. All numbers and the phrase "hit points" used solely for illustrative purposes, they have no IG reality at all.
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>>I don't get it.
In the past, if you took a hit that would've taken you past 0 "hit points" (I know DR doesn't use hit points, bear with me it's an analogy), you'd be dead.
Now you have a buffer. If you take a hit that takes you between 0 and -10 hit points, you are in a "dying" state where you are unconscious, but aren't yet dead. You can be rescued, tended, and you might live.
If you take hits that would bring you /below/ -10, you're dead just like you used to be.
There are other nuances (like if your head gets ripped off putting you at -5, you still die, since you can't be "dying" without a head, though apparently one can still post on the boards with no head...) but that's the meat of it.
From the empathic perspective, it helps because many people will be lingering longer -- and getting wounded worse because they're lingering -- than previously, and can be snatched from the jaws of death without actually dying. That means more people living through terrible injuries that might've killed them before. Since they're not dead, they don't depart, and instead come to -- you guessed it! -- their friendly neighborhood empath for healing.
~ Nutawa
P.S. All numbers and the phrase "hit points" used solely for illustrative purposes, they have no IG reality at all.
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> Now you have a buffer. If you take a hit that takes you between 0 and -10 hit points, you are in a "dying" state where you are unconscious, but aren't yet dead. You can be rescued, tended, and you might live.
>If you take hits that would bring you /below/ -10, you're dead just like you used to be.
I don't think it's this simple.
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
>If you take hits that would bring you /below/ -10, you're dead just like you used to be.
I don't think it's this simple.
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
>>I don't think it's this simple.
That would be the part where I said there were other nuances, and where the numbers were all made up :-) I got the impression she was looking for a "big picture" view, so that's what I gave. There are obviously complexities but I have written so many extremely long, involved posts that I thought I'd have mercy and keep it basic.
To expand just a bit more, once you get into "negative hit points" you continue to lose "hit points" until you get below the magic number. Then you die. This can be from bleeding, from additional hits, and probably lots of other things I don't know about.
If the mood strikes you to make a response longer than just one line to share something useful, Ythik, feel free. I'm always happy to learn.
~ Nutawa
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That would be the part where I said there were other nuances, and where the numbers were all made up :-) I got the impression she was looking for a "big picture" view, so that's what I gave. There are obviously complexities but I have written so many extremely long, involved posts that I thought I'd have mercy and keep it basic.
To expand just a bit more, once you get into "negative hit points" you continue to lose "hit points" until you get below the magic number. Then you die. This can be from bleeding, from additional hits, and probably lots of other things I don't know about.
If the mood strikes you to make a response longer than just one line to share something useful, Ythik, feel free. I'm always happy to learn.
~ Nutawa
_______________________________
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Gidske's Armor Guide: http://www.heromachine.com/drealms/
Oops I missed that part.
Ok here's my best guess from the information I've gotten.
When you would otherwise normally die by dropping below 100% vitality loss, your body performs a check to see if it's able to go into 'dying' mode instead. If you have fatal wounds (missing CHNAB) you will be dead. There's nothing your body can do if you are missing a vital organ.
If that isn't the case your body throws a last ditch effort to keep you alive. As far as I can tell what it does is pull from other resources (fatigue for sure, maybe some other things) available and create some phantom vitality. This will boost you up to some other amount of vitality loss, let's say 75%.
Now if you lose your phantom vitality through normal means (you are hit, your bleeders pulse, something like that) and you will die. The best way to put this I guess is, if you are 'dying' and you drop back down to 100% vitality loss again, you will die.
Now after you recover from 'dying' your phantom vitality will go away (similar to the way Barbarians lose their phantom vitality when they un-beserk). Like barbarians, if this loss in vitality drops you below 100% then you will die. I don't think there's a chance to go back into dying as you come out. In other words, when you lose your phantom vitality, there's no second chance; if that causes you to go below 100% then you're dead.
I'm also fairly sure you lose some greater amount than you gained. There's a sort of interest to it. It may dependent on how much fatigue you've regained or something along those lines.
So to get to dying instead of becoming dead: Avoid wounds that destroy body parts, higher fatigue will help you survive (if you have no reserves to pull from you cannot go into dying, this is probably why the recently-departed person that someone mentioned earlier just died, as opposed to going into dying. Their body had no fatigue to convert to vitality.), the less the killing blow takes you past 100% probably affects your chances as well.
To survive dying: don't get hit, don't bleed, avoid any further vitality loss, recover fatigue, recover vitality past 0% loss if possible (through courage, GOL or the like). In short the healthier you can become before you un-dying the better.
To save the dying: accomplish as many of the above as possible. Drag people out of combat, tend bleeders, HL or NB them, get them vitality fast. I'm inclined to say wounds don't matter as much, though they probably do affect your survival rate some. Of course healing bleeders is very important, especially internals.
Standard disclaimer: all of the above is my own opinions and/or guesses and is not guaranteed to help you survive your dying. Nor is it guaranteed to be correct.
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
Ok here's my best guess from the information I've gotten.
When you would otherwise normally die by dropping below 100% vitality loss, your body performs a check to see if it's able to go into 'dying' mode instead. If you have fatal wounds (missing CHNAB) you will be dead. There's nothing your body can do if you are missing a vital organ.
If that isn't the case your body throws a last ditch effort to keep you alive. As far as I can tell what it does is pull from other resources (fatigue for sure, maybe some other things) available and create some phantom vitality. This will boost you up to some other amount of vitality loss, let's say 75%.
Now if you lose your phantom vitality through normal means (you are hit, your bleeders pulse, something like that) and you will die. The best way to put this I guess is, if you are 'dying' and you drop back down to 100% vitality loss again, you will die.
Now after you recover from 'dying' your phantom vitality will go away (similar to the way Barbarians lose their phantom vitality when they un-beserk). Like barbarians, if this loss in vitality drops you below 100% then you will die. I don't think there's a chance to go back into dying as you come out. In other words, when you lose your phantom vitality, there's no second chance; if that causes you to go below 100% then you're dead.
I'm also fairly sure you lose some greater amount than you gained. There's a sort of interest to it. It may dependent on how much fatigue you've regained or something along those lines.
So to get to dying instead of becoming dead: Avoid wounds that destroy body parts, higher fatigue will help you survive (if you have no reserves to pull from you cannot go into dying, this is probably why the recently-departed person that someone mentioned earlier just died, as opposed to going into dying. Their body had no fatigue to convert to vitality.), the less the killing blow takes you past 100% probably affects your chances as well.
To survive dying: don't get hit, don't bleed, avoid any further vitality loss, recover fatigue, recover vitality past 0% loss if possible (through courage, GOL or the like). In short the healthier you can become before you un-dying the better.
To save the dying: accomplish as many of the above as possible. Drag people out of combat, tend bleeders, HL or NB them, get them vitality fast. I'm inclined to say wounds don't matter as much, though they probably do affect your survival rate some. Of course healing bleeders is very important, especially internals.
Standard disclaimer: all of the above is my own opinions and/or guesses and is not guaranteed to help you survive your dying. Nor is it guaranteed to be correct.
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
Thanks, that was very informative. I haven't had a chance to do much dying yet (thankfully!) so it's good to see what all's going on.
One minor correction though:
>>Now after you recover from 'dying' your phantom vitality will go away (similar to the way Barbarians lose their phantom vitality when they un-beserk). Like barbarians, if this loss in vitality drops you below 100% then you will die.
This is no longer the case, as of a while back. When you come out of berserking you are now at 100% vitality. Of course any bleeders you accumulated while berserking are still there ready to sap your vitality, but you no longer come out on the brink of death. It's good to be a barb :-)
~ Nutawa
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One minor correction though:
>>Now after you recover from 'dying' your phantom vitality will go away (similar to the way Barbarians lose their phantom vitality when they un-beserk). Like barbarians, if this loss in vitality drops you below 100% then you will die.
This is no longer the case, as of a while back. When you come out of berserking you are now at 100% vitality. Of course any bleeders you accumulated while berserking are still there ready to sap your vitality, but you no longer come out on the brink of death. It's good to be a barb :-)
~ Nutawa
_______________________________
Indigoe's Weapons Guide: http://members.cox.net/trader-indigoe/weapon.html
Gidske's Armor Guide: http://www.heromachine.com/drealms/
Ok, I think I am beginning to understand it now. Dying is comparable to... having overdraft protection on my checking account if it goes into negative balance? Thank you Nutawa and Ythik for your explanations of it. And bless you both for not competing for longest long-winded post!
'Lint
No I am not saying you talk alot Ythik. <snicker>
umm nor you Nutawa!
'Lint
No I am not saying you talk alot Ythik. <snicker>
umm nor you Nutawa!
>No I am not saying you talk alot Ythik. <snicker>
<doesn't say anything>
<kicks Lint in that non-damaging way that doesn't cause shock but still hurts like the dickens>
<hums>
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
<doesn't say anything>
<kicks Lint in that non-damaging way that doesn't cause shock but still hurts like the dickens>
<hums>
~Y
Ever wonder about those Elotheans? Check out the library at:
http://www.bakshiloa.com
