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Only 4 germish in the room and with a 26+35 mana cast of TKS the following happened. This is mostly duplicatible with high mana casts. Low mana casts still only do 1 hit per creature, so did TKS become multi-strike AoE without someone mentioning it to me?
> cast
You gesture.
You contribute your harnessed streams to increase the pattern's potential.
Your cambrinth armband emits a loud snap as it discharges all its power to aid your spell.
An ominous rustling comes from all around as debris takes flight of its own accord!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a hard (6/23) hit to its left leg!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a powerful (11/23) strike to its left leg!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a good (4/23) strike to its neck!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a solid (5/23) hit to its back!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a solid (5/23) hit to its neck!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a good (4/23) hit to its right eye!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a good (4/23) hit to its head!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a good (4/23) hit to its abdomen!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a hard (6/23) hit to its left leg!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a solid (5/23) hit to its abdomen!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a good (4/23) hit to its chest!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a solid (5/23) hit to its neck!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
It manages to get out of the way!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a hard (6/23) hit to its back!
A wee crimson sliver suddenly swings from orbiting around your head and zips toward a misshapen germish'din!
The crimson sliver lands a light (2/23) hit to its left leg!
The crimson sliver explodes into even tinier multicoloured fragments and vanishes!
Roundtime: 2 sec.
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It just appears that like with TKT, TKS increases the number of hits per target with more mana. Given the target cap of 6 creatures this means up to 18 hits per cast at the level I can cast it at. (Possibly 24 since I can't cap it yet.) I'm not sure if this is intended or not, but I had always thought the spell in 3.1 was supposed to be a single strike per target AoE only. Granted, I have always cast it with near minimum prep until just recently, so I don't actually know.
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>It just appears that like with TKT, TKS increases the number of hits per target with more mana. Given the target cap of 6 creatures this means up to 18 hits per cast at the level I can cast it at. (Possibly 24 since I can't cap it yet.) I'm not sure if this is intended or not, but I had always thought the spell in 3.1 was supposed to be a single strike per target AoE only. Granted, I have always cast it with near minimum prep until just recently, so I don't actually know.
You're the kid in the class who reminded the teacher that homework was due when they forgot weren't you?
TKT and TKS have been harped on about their lack of power and not being in line with what they should at this point, the last thing we need is another down-tweak for TKS at this point.
Your figures are far off btw. With capped TKS (which is all I cast it at - 100 mana) the most I get are two strikes per creature on four creatures max (only the creatures engaged are hit), and I've been using this spell for the past month at least. There is no three or four strike per creature that I have ever seen.
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You're the kid in the class who reminded the teacher that homework was due when they forgot weren't you?
TKT and TKS have been harped on about their lack of power and not being in line with what they should at this point, the last thing we need is another down-tweak for TKS at this point.
Your figures are far off btw. With capped TKS (which is all I cast it at - 100 mana) the most I get are two strikes per creature on four creatures max (only the creatures engaged are hit), and I've been using this spell for the past month at least. There is no three or four strike per creature that I have ever seen.
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<<Your figures are far off btw. With capped TKS (which is all I cast it at - 100 mana) the most I get are two strikes per creature on four creatures max (only the creatures engaged are hit), and I've been using this spell for the past month at least. There is no three or four strike per creature that I have ever seen.
My log above belies your statement. 15 strikes against 5 creatures. (Checking my logs there were actually 5 in the room and I had used TARGET TKS AT CREATURES.) You might be noticing less if one or more of the targets die since additional strikes don't occur, or it has something to do with the at creatures option.
<<You're the kid in the class who reminded the teacher that homework was due when they forgot weren't you?
<<TKT and TKS have been harped on about their lack of power and not being in line with what they should at this point, the last thing we need is another down-tweak for TKS at this point.
So your solution is to abuse a mechanics issue? Got it.
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My log above belies your statement. 15 strikes against 5 creatures. (Checking my logs there were actually 5 in the room and I had used TARGET TKS AT CREATURES.) You might be noticing less if one or more of the targets die since additional strikes don't occur, or it has something to do with the at creatures option.
<<You're the kid in the class who reminded the teacher that homework was due when they forgot weren't you?
<<TKT and TKS have been harped on about their lack of power and not being in line with what they should at this point, the last thing we need is another down-tweak for TKS at this point.
So your solution is to abuse a mechanics issue? Got it.
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>I hate both of these spells so much. ><
Completely understandable. I actually kinda like TKS right now (not saying there can't be improvement still)
>So your solution is to abuse a mechanics issue? Got it.
No, my solution is to let things be and operate under the assumption that that's the way they were intended Unless for some reason something is inherently wrong. The number of strikes has nothing to do with the fact that it takes four casts at full mana, full prep with tks to kill a creature, which is in line with all other TM spells that I have/do use. There is nothing wrong with it so why go trying to point out that our only AoE TM spell might be messed up? If it was one-shotting everything I might understand but it's not. The power is in line, who cares how many actual hits it gets?
>My log above belies your statement. 15 strikes against 5 creatures. (Checking my logs there were actually 5 in the room and I had used TARGET TKS AT CREATURES.) You might be noticing less if one or more of the targets die since additional strikes don't occur, or it has something to do with the at creatures option.
As far as your testing of one bout, I have months of logs casting at full prep, full mana like I said. You may be correct and I too have had three strikes per creature. But the normality of all my data is that its two strikes per creature at full mana and it takes between 3 and 4 full casts to kill anything.
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Completely understandable. I actually kinda like TKS right now (not saying there can't be improvement still)
>So your solution is to abuse a mechanics issue? Got it.
No, my solution is to let things be and operate under the assumption that that's the way they were intended Unless for some reason something is inherently wrong. The number of strikes has nothing to do with the fact that it takes four casts at full mana, full prep with tks to kill a creature, which is in line with all other TM spells that I have/do use. There is nothing wrong with it so why go trying to point out that our only AoE TM spell might be messed up? If it was one-shotting everything I might understand but it's not. The power is in line, who cares how many actual hits it gets?
>My log above belies your statement. 15 strikes against 5 creatures. (Checking my logs there were actually 5 in the room and I had used TARGET TKS AT CREATURES.) You might be noticing less if one or more of the targets die since additional strikes don't occur, or it has something to do with the at creatures option.
As far as your testing of one bout, I have months of logs casting at full prep, full mana like I said. You may be correct and I too have had three strikes per creature. But the normality of all my data is that its two strikes per creature at full mana and it takes between 3 and 4 full casts to kill anything.
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At its core TKS is a multi-strike AOE spell, which is limited to a maximum of 3 strikes per target. There's plenty of other variables that may affect how many strikes you get using the same mana for that particular spell, but getting 3 strikes is perfectly normal and reasonable.
ASGM Ricinus
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Core, Logistics, Survival
Cleric Advocate
<<At its core TKS is a multi-strike AOE spell, which is limited to a maximum of 3 strikes per target. There's plenty of other variables that may affect how many strikes you get using the same mana for that particular spell, but getting 3 strikes is perfectly normal and reasonable.
Perfect. Elanthipedia reflects this now.
<<As far as your testing of one bout,
I spent quite a bit of time testing after that one log. Indoors vs. outdoors. Different creatures. Slivers vs. normal ammunition.
<<No, my solution is to let things be and operate under the assumption that that's the way they were intended Unless for some reason something is inherently wrong. The number of strikes has nothing to do with the fact that it takes four casts at full mana, full prep with tks to kill a creature, which is in line with all other TM spells that I have/do use. There is nothing wrong with it so why go trying to point out that our only AoE TM spell might be messed up?
What a nifty justification for potential mech abuse. When the knowledge is that it is supposed to be single strike AoE and instead is behaving as multi-strike AoE then there is potentially something wrong, then pointing it out instead of coming up with a questionable justification for taking advantage of it is not a bad thing to do.
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Perfect. Elanthipedia reflects this now.
<<As far as your testing of one bout,
I spent quite a bit of time testing after that one log. Indoors vs. outdoors. Different creatures. Slivers vs. normal ammunition.
<<No, my solution is to let things be and operate under the assumption that that's the way they were intended Unless for some reason something is inherently wrong. The number of strikes has nothing to do with the fact that it takes four casts at full mana, full prep with tks to kill a creature, which is in line with all other TM spells that I have/do use. There is nothing wrong with it so why go trying to point out that our only AoE TM spell might be messed up?
What a nifty justification for potential mech abuse. When the knowledge is that it is supposed to be single strike AoE and instead is behaving as multi-strike AoE then there is potentially something wrong, then pointing it out instead of coming up with a questionable justification for taking advantage of it is not a bad thing to do.
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>At its core TKS is a multi-strike AOE spell, which is limited to a maximum of 3 strikes per target. There's plenty of other variables that may affect how many strikes you get using the same mana for that particular spell, but getting 3 strikes is perfectly normal and reasonable.
YAY!! Thank you for the clarification!!
>What a nifty justification for potential mech abuse.
Hahah, I disagree. Mech abuse would be knowing something that is not acting as intended and deliberately trying to cover it up/use it to gain advantage. When a spell takes the same number of casts to do the same thing to creatures as just about every other spell it doesn't warrant mech abuse because it's not an advantage. Just because tks uses multiple shards instead of a single shard has no impact, unless you're purposely trying to claim that tks is overpowered and needs to take 8-9 casts, and to only have one shard hit each creature per casting. What was your endgame to pointing out there were multiple shards?
>then pointing it out instead of coming up with a questionable justification for taking advantage of it is not a bad thing to do.
The problem here with your logic is that you took one single variable to the spell (the number of shards) and focused on that instead of looking at the spell as a whole and asking yourself "is this operating in line with power balance, other spells, etc.", which is what I was, and am, trying to point out. It's not overpowered, it's not unbalanced, it performs in line with other spells as a whole.
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YAY!! Thank you for the clarification!!
>What a nifty justification for potential mech abuse.
Hahah, I disagree. Mech abuse would be knowing something that is not acting as intended and deliberately trying to cover it up/use it to gain advantage. When a spell takes the same number of casts to do the same thing to creatures as just about every other spell it doesn't warrant mech abuse because it's not an advantage. Just because tks uses multiple shards instead of a single shard has no impact, unless you're purposely trying to claim that tks is overpowered and needs to take 8-9 casts, and to only have one shard hit each creature per casting. What was your endgame to pointing out there were multiple shards?
>then pointing it out instead of coming up with a questionable justification for taking advantage of it is not a bad thing to do.
The problem here with your logic is that you took one single variable to the spell (the number of shards) and focused on that instead of looking at the spell as a whole and asking yourself "is this operating in line with power balance, other spells, etc.", which is what I was, and am, trying to point out. It's not overpowered, it's not unbalanced, it performs in line with other spells as a whole.
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TKS is actually broken and is between the two right now. I need to talk to the rest of the magic team to figure out which way to correct it.
On one hand, it's documented as single-shot AoE and it's using that damage template, and so far as I know - that's always been the intent for it.
On the other hand, there's a comment in the code saying it's intended to be multi-strike (On the same line that sets it to use the single-strike template) and it's running through multi-strike mechanics when it does the actual strike count.
So either it was intentionally, but incorrectly, converted at some point (Which is possible during 3.1, there were a lot of GMs involved and a lot of spells discussed - I might be misremembering this one and unfortunately the last GM to work on the spell is no longer with us so I can't ask), or at some point some multi-strike code slipped into it that shouldn't be there (most likely in one of the many attempts to fix it and TKT's various other bugs since the two spells share a fair bit of code).
Whichever way we push it, it's currently doing more damage then any AoE spell should be. Which, I know, isn't going to be a popular thing to hear.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
On one hand, it's documented as single-shot AoE and it's using that damage template, and so far as I know - that's always been the intent for it.
On the other hand, there's a comment in the code saying it's intended to be multi-strike (On the same line that sets it to use the single-strike template) and it's running through multi-strike mechanics when it does the actual strike count.
So either it was intentionally, but incorrectly, converted at some point (Which is possible during 3.1, there were a lot of GMs involved and a lot of spells discussed - I might be misremembering this one and unfortunately the last GM to work on the spell is no longer with us so I can't ask), or at some point some multi-strike code slipped into it that shouldn't be there (most likely in one of the many attempts to fix it and TKT's various other bugs since the two spells share a fair bit of code).
Whichever way we push it, it's currently doing more damage then any AoE spell should be. Which, I know, isn't going to be a popular thing to hear.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
<<Mech abuse would be knowing something that is not acting as intended and deliberately trying to cover it up/use it to gain advantage.
Not reporting an ability that is supposed to do one thing and it is doing something else by reasoning that you think it probably should be that way anyway is covering it up. Just because you think it should be that way doesn't make it somehow not hiding something.
<<What was your endgame to pointing out there were multiple shards?
The spell is supposed to do things a certain way. It's not doing things that way. I reported it. End of story.
I dislike getting called out for reporting a potential bug just because some people don't like that it might result in a nerf. I have better standards than that.
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Not reporting an ability that is supposed to do one thing and it is doing something else by reasoning that you think it probably should be that way anyway is covering it up. Just because you think it should be that way doesn't make it somehow not hiding something.
<<What was your endgame to pointing out there were multiple shards?
The spell is supposed to do things a certain way. It's not doing things that way. I reported it. End of story.
I dislike getting called out for reporting a potential bug just because some people don't like that it might result in a nerf. I have better standards than that.
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>Whichever way we push it, it's currently doing more damage then any AoE spell should be. Which, I know, isn't going to be a popular thing to hear
Dang, definitely not. From the damage point of view it seem in line with damage from other spells like DO and PD and TKT - i.e. it takes about the same number of casts to kill any creature. If the damage is modified down where it takes double the amount of casts at the very least in order to kill creatures I know I'll definitely be veering away from having it in my arsenal.
>I dislike getting called out for reporting a potential bug just because some people don't like that it might result in a nerf. I have better standards than that.
Sorry your feelings got hurt, but nit-picking over minor issues that, again, don't add up to the whole, and in my opinion - diverting GM time and awareness to non-issues away from issues, projects and other prevalent bugs that Are game balancing doesn't make sense. You were saying the spell is broken, I'm pointing out that as a whole it's not. Based upon the spell as a whole, and not just the messaging of more than one shard per target and elanthipedia being wrong. Agree to Disagree.
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Dang, definitely not. From the damage point of view it seem in line with damage from other spells like DO and PD and TKT - i.e. it takes about the same number of casts to kill any creature. If the damage is modified down where it takes double the amount of casts at the very least in order to kill creatures I know I'll definitely be veering away from having it in my arsenal.
>I dislike getting called out for reporting a potential bug just because some people don't like that it might result in a nerf. I have better standards than that.
Sorry your feelings got hurt, but nit-picking over minor issues that, again, don't add up to the whole, and in my opinion - diverting GM time and awareness to non-issues away from issues, projects and other prevalent bugs that Are game balancing doesn't make sense. You were saying the spell is broken, I'm pointing out that as a whole it's not. Based upon the spell as a whole, and not just the messaging of more than one shard per target and elanthipedia being wrong. Agree to Disagree.
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>Except it is.
My bad then. Apologies all around.
If it's not intended to be at least the strength of other tm spells (i.e. kill something at level with around 4-5 casts) then I'll just write it off, forget the spell, and not worry about it.
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My bad then. Apologies all around.
If it's not intended to be at least the strength of other tm spells (i.e. kill something at level with around 4-5 casts) then I'll just write it off, forget the spell, and not worry about it.
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>>If it's not intended to be at least the strength of other tm spells (i.e. kill something at level with around 4-5 casts)
It's an AoE spell. It's not intended to kill a something at level at the same speed as other spells. It's intended to kill multiple things at once.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
It's an AoE spell. It's not intended to kill a something at level at the same speed as other spells. It's intended to kill multiple things at once.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
>It's an AoE spell. It's not intended to kill a something at level at the same speed as other spells. It's intended to kill multiple things at once.
No offense, but I don't understand.
Are you saying that specifically since it attacks multiple targets at the same time that it has to be underpowered/nerfed/not in line with regular TM spells and will take double to triple the number of casts in order to accomplish what a non-AoE spell would as far as killing a creature at level? What is the point of AoE then?
If it takes me 4 casts of PD/TKT/DO on average to kill something and you make it so that it takes 4 * the number of critters casts to kill whatever I'm hunting with TKS why in the world would I not just use TKT/PD/DO, or even better yet, my Throwing axe which I can throw three times to kill said creature (with not even half the roundtime)??? There is no benefit at all to filling my spell slots with said spell and I will gladly forget TKT and TKS in order to make room since I don't have enough spell slots as it is.
There is all this talk about TM being overpowered and this, that and the other, but look at how many swings of a weapon it takes to kill something with 3-4 RT as opposed to prep, target, cast of 12-15 seconds per spell. Not even delving into thrown where you can lob and kill something in 4-5 hits with 2 RT per throw, thereby killing something before it would take me time to target and cast a spell at full mana when it's at full prep.
This just frustrates me, and as a moon mage primary, and not even considering playing another guild as my primary, it makes no sense whatsoever just because someone else can prep at 100 mana and throw an axe or something while the spell is prepping. That should have no bearing on the actual spell ability and damage IMHO as it's an outside factor that someone may train and someone else may not train, so you shouldn't penalize the whole population on TM because oh, you are ABLE to do this much damage and that's unfair, whether everyone is actually trained and able to and does it or not. It's like saying, 'while you're aiming that crossbow, bow, whatever, you can't do anything else because it would do too much damage and not be in line with whatever'. It makes no sense. Honestly if you want to do anything, the most sense would be to nerf weapons for mages (as if they aren't already enough by being tertiary). This would allow the mages to cast at the potential that they should without the extra damage modifier because no one is allowed to be better than someone else and everyone deserves a trophy for participation.
Sorry for the rant, but it really bothers me that my main source of damage keeps getting nerfed because of the Potential for stacking or whatever. Don't penalize my main source, penalize the additional stacking sources if you penalize anything and give a bonus where bonus is due. I'm a master of magic. Let me use that as a mastery. There are 10 magic skills, I should be able to utilize all of them at their fullest. Barbarians weapons aren't nerfed because they can do whatever during their wait time of aiming or whatever. Paladins armor skills aren't nerfed because they can switch armor while hunting creatures, etc. etc.
TL:DR Stop penalizing magic primary guilds, especially in the manner of TM, because they have the Ability to train other Tertiary skills.
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No offense, but I don't understand.
Are you saying that specifically since it attacks multiple targets at the same time that it has to be underpowered/nerfed/not in line with regular TM spells and will take double to triple the number of casts in order to accomplish what a non-AoE spell would as far as killing a creature at level? What is the point of AoE then?
If it takes me 4 casts of PD/TKT/DO on average to kill something and you make it so that it takes 4 * the number of critters casts to kill whatever I'm hunting with TKS why in the world would I not just use TKT/PD/DO, or even better yet, my Throwing axe which I can throw three times to kill said creature (with not even half the roundtime)??? There is no benefit at all to filling my spell slots with said spell and I will gladly forget TKT and TKS in order to make room since I don't have enough spell slots as it is.
There is all this talk about TM being overpowered and this, that and the other, but look at how many swings of a weapon it takes to kill something with 3-4 RT as opposed to prep, target, cast of 12-15 seconds per spell. Not even delving into thrown where you can lob and kill something in 4-5 hits with 2 RT per throw, thereby killing something before it would take me time to target and cast a spell at full mana when it's at full prep.
This just frustrates me, and as a moon mage primary, and not even considering playing another guild as my primary, it makes no sense whatsoever just because someone else can prep at 100 mana and throw an axe or something while the spell is prepping. That should have no bearing on the actual spell ability and damage IMHO as it's an outside factor that someone may train and someone else may not train, so you shouldn't penalize the whole population on TM because oh, you are ABLE to do this much damage and that's unfair, whether everyone is actually trained and able to and does it or not. It's like saying, 'while you're aiming that crossbow, bow, whatever, you can't do anything else because it would do too much damage and not be in line with whatever'. It makes no sense. Honestly if you want to do anything, the most sense would be to nerf weapons for mages (as if they aren't already enough by being tertiary). This would allow the mages to cast at the potential that they should without the extra damage modifier because no one is allowed to be better than someone else and everyone deserves a trophy for participation.
Sorry for the rant, but it really bothers me that my main source of damage keeps getting nerfed because of the Potential for stacking or whatever. Don't penalize my main source, penalize the additional stacking sources if you penalize anything and give a bonus where bonus is due. I'm a master of magic. Let me use that as a mastery. There are 10 magic skills, I should be able to utilize all of them at their fullest. Barbarians weapons aren't nerfed because they can do whatever during their wait time of aiming or whatever. Paladins armor skills aren't nerfed because they can switch armor while hunting creatures, etc. etc.
TL:DR Stop penalizing magic primary guilds, especially in the manner of TM, because they have the Ability to train other Tertiary skills.
Mmmmm...pie
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You are reading far too much until what I said. All I said was that, on a per target basis, an aoe spell will kill slower than a single target one. I never said double or triple.
And that just makes sense, else there is no reason for single target spells to exist.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
And that just makes sense, else there is no reason for single target spells to exist.
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
I agree, if one critter eats 4ish single targets to die, there should be nothing wrong with 8-12ish aoe casts to drop 4-6 creatures at once. You will be damaging, decreasing position/balance, and stunning said critters during the damaging process. Single cast should be the weapon of choice for one or two targets.
>I agree, if one critter eats 4ish single targets to die, there should be nothing wrong with 8-12ish aoe casts to drop 4-6 creatures at once. You will be damaging, decreasing position/balance, and stunning said critters during the damaging process. Single cast should be the weapon of choice for one or two targets.
I'm just going to but in one last time on this topic as a primarily war-mage player and then shut up forever.
Single cast is still the weapon of choice for 4-6 creatures (and why are there even 5-6 creatures? Are you in invasions once a month?). At least it still is with the relatively low ranks of 346 TM, 462 attuement and 488 PM.
I can start casting Chain Lightning at 30 mana, and kill four targets, killing one target after about a minute and a half, and dropping them all after two minutes; 5-7 casts. This costs 180 to 210 mana and drops me to the edge of my attunement regeneration (10/15%). This sounds mostly fine with a couple caveats. First, that's a minute and a half of full MO penalty: I'm getting hit! Yes things are getting stunned, but it's not helping enough. If I debilitated with those casts instead, everything would be stunned and I would have time for single-target casts in between debilitation. Second, in a non-test situation (I went into this will full health, fatigue, and no wounds) am probably getting hit Really Badly and unlikely to have mana for more than 2-3 casts, which may not even kill the creature I am facing.
Things wackily break down when you compare single-target casts, though. I can start casting Aether Lash at 30 mana (Which may even be at a slight handicap from being physical damage only), and kill one target in about 40 seconds with 3-4 casts for 90 to 120 mana. OR, I can cast Aether Lash at 1 mana, kill one target in 45-50 seconds with 4-5 cast for 5 mana. I'm not sweating those ten seconds compared to the over half-a-minute difference between time-to-kill with equal-powered single target vs AOE. You add in swinging weapons and single-target gets that much better.
You can also start to see that the real power of Cyclic TM is how cheap and fast it is compared to single-strike AOE (though still more expensive and slower than single target, you can run them both at the same time).
Forget your AOE TM, especially as a moon mage, those slots are better spent on a diverse debilitation contest suite and a couple choices of single-target damage.
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
I'm just going to but in one last time on this topic as a primarily war-mage player and then shut up forever.
Single cast is still the weapon of choice for 4-6 creatures (and why are there even 5-6 creatures? Are you in invasions once a month?). At least it still is with the relatively low ranks of 346 TM, 462 attuement and 488 PM.
I can start casting Chain Lightning at 30 mana, and kill four targets, killing one target after about a minute and a half, and dropping them all after two minutes; 5-7 casts. This costs 180 to 210 mana and drops me to the edge of my attunement regeneration (10/15%). This sounds mostly fine with a couple caveats. First, that's a minute and a half of full MO penalty: I'm getting hit! Yes things are getting stunned, but it's not helping enough. If I debilitated with those casts instead, everything would be stunned and I would have time for single-target casts in between debilitation. Second, in a non-test situation (I went into this will full health, fatigue, and no wounds) am probably getting hit Really Badly and unlikely to have mana for more than 2-3 casts, which may not even kill the creature I am facing.
Things wackily break down when you compare single-target casts, though. I can start casting Aether Lash at 30 mana (Which may even be at a slight handicap from being physical damage only), and kill one target in about 40 seconds with 3-4 casts for 90 to 120 mana. OR, I can cast Aether Lash at 1 mana, kill one target in 45-50 seconds with 4-5 cast for 5 mana. I'm not sweating those ten seconds compared to the over half-a-minute difference between time-to-kill with equal-powered single target vs AOE. You add in swinging weapons and single-target gets that much better.
You can also start to see that the real power of Cyclic TM is how cheap and fast it is compared to single-strike AOE (though still more expensive and slower than single target, you can run them both at the same time).
Forget your AOE TM, especially as a moon mage, those slots are better spent on a diverse debilitation contest suite and a couple choices of single-target damage.
>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
