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out of curiosity, and sorry if this was answered before, but I sort of assumed that this shop was going to be open for good, thus I just picked up one or two items I knew I wanted right away and have left...
Now like many of us I have 100s if not 1000s of plats strewn about that I'm not using, simply assuming I can come back and pick out the items I want whenever I want... is this shop going to abruptly close with Guildfest leaving me feeling like an idiot cuz I didn't just buy everything when I had the chance? Or can I keep playing with my new toys down in Illithi and go back to get new ones when I feel like making the trip to throne? Thanks if anyone can answer.
Here is a fuzzy situation...
I find someone clearly carrying Fade weapons (wearing snipers Xbows) but there is no clear indication he is guilded, so I attempt to communicate, but get no response. He is clearly running a script so I keep tracking him down and attempt to interact but no joy. I stalk him around, unsure what to do as he is PVP closed.
Policy wise do I have a green light to get shiv happy? I can't tell if he is guilded since he won't respond and I would hate to kill a fellow Thief, and also if he is AFK scripting then interrupting it could also land me in hot water.
Yours,
Confused.
I find someone clearly carrying Fade weapons (wearing snipers Xbows) but there is no clear indication he is guilded, so I attempt to communicate, but get no response. He is clearly running a script so I keep tracking him down and attempt to interact but no joy. I stalk him around, unsure what to do as he is PVP closed.
Policy wise do I have a green light to get shiv happy? I can't tell if he is guilded since he won't respond and I would hate to kill a fellow Thief, and also if he is AFK scripting then interrupting it could also land me in hot water.
Yours,
Confused.
If you suspect someone of AFK scripting, I would report them and walk away regardless of the Fade weapon(s). I wouldn't want to jeopardize my character for a 20 plat text weapon; plus it's not that fun interacting with someone who ignores you.
If you're set on recovering the weapon and it's been a significant amount of time since your report (say somewhere between a day and a week), I would make sure to follow and read the policy on Fade weapons again. https://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=20&category=1&topic=1&message=3091
Verbally confronting the character is a good first step as is using MARK ITEM. Continue to verbally ask for the weapon for the required 7 minute time limit. After that, I believe you can "get shiv happy." Though I don't know how you'll recover the weapon if they are simply wearing it.
Nikpack
The gods are jerks. No, really.-Armifer
I don't think we ever take the training wheels off as players or gamemasters.-Inauri
If you're set on recovering the weapon and it's been a significant amount of time since your report (say somewhere between a day and a week), I would make sure to follow and read the policy on Fade weapons again. https://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=20&category=1&topic=1&message=3091
Verbally confronting the character is a good first step as is using MARK ITEM. Continue to verbally ask for the weapon for the required 7 minute time limit. After that, I believe you can "get shiv happy." Though I don't know how you'll recover the weapon if they are simply wearing it.
Nikpack
The gods are jerks. No, really.-Armifer
I don't think we ever take the training wheels off as players or gamemasters.-Inauri
Would really like a way for guilded thieves to be able to loot the corpse of any fade weapons. Otherwise you end up having to camp the person until they either give up the weapons or you can pluck them from their grave when/if they depart without taking their items with them.
"I think I just had an evilgasm." - Lord Xykon: Order of the Stick
"I think I just had an evilgasm." - Lord Xykon: Order of the Stick
You don't need to camp anyone, but make it clear to them that keeping hold of the weapon(s) could become very inconvenient. I found someone with some Fade weapons and just RPed the situation through. No violence ensued in that case, but the chap was certainly aware it was imminent. I pointed out that the people he needed to worry about were not the type he would see coming.
The people who should be mercilessly pursued are the ones supplying the items to non Thieves.
The people who should be mercilessly pursued are the ones supplying the items to non Thieves.
The shop was only around for the guild festival earlier in the year. Hopefully it will be back next year, but no word either way.
I'm pretty sure that MARK ITEM only checks what the character's inventory for Fade weapons, so there's no way to tell if someone has one squirreled away in their vault.
If I remember the Fade Weapon policy correctly Thieves can only take them away from non-Thieves. But, if you confront someone about having a Fade Weapon and they refuse to identify themself as a Thief, then they're fair game. I'd recommend getting a second opinion on that though, as I could be completely off.
I'm pretty sure that MARK ITEM only checks what the character's inventory for Fade weapons, so there's no way to tell if someone has one squirreled away in their vault.
If I remember the Fade Weapon policy correctly Thieves can only take them away from non-Thieves. But, if you confront someone about having a Fade Weapon and they refuse to identify themself as a Thief, then they're fair game. I'd recommend getting a second opinion on that though, as I could be completely off.
if they're vaulted obviously nobody can get to them.
and the weapons are around, but the place you could get 'em is not. <was a "festival" time merchant>
You've seen life through distorted eyes;You know you had to learn;The execution of your mind;You really had to turn;,the book is read,The end begins to show,The truth is out, the lies are old, But you don't want to know - Black Sabbath
and the weapons are around, but the place you could get 'em is not. <was a "festival" time merchant>
You've seen life through distorted eyes;You know you had to learn;The execution of your mind;You really had to turn;,the book is read,The end begins to show,The truth is out, the lies are old, But you don't want to know - Black Sabbath
ok, so yeah, once I marked and discover that a non-thief have it, is there anything I can actually do to take away other than verbal threats (and consented violence)? Or they'd just have to eventually give it up willingly?
Anyone who's been sporting both the fade item game and assassins game can compare them for me how they feel when put to practice?
Anyone who's been sporting both the fade item game and assassins game can compare them for me how they feel when put to practice?
This is from in game NEWS regarding the Fade weapons and spells out the answers to your questions.
Dateline 5/17/2010: TRACKABLE THIEF-ONLY ITEMS
IC: Rumors abound of a new commercial enterprise stemming from the ruins of Throne City: a new merchant who sells goods to a very select clientele. Word has spread that these items are intended to remain in the hands of the worthy, and any outsider possessing one or more articles will certainly encounter trouble from the underground.
OOC: With the opening of GuildFest 2010 comes the release of King Fade's Back Alley Bazaar: a new shop exclusively for members of the Thieves' Guild. All weapons sold by this merchant are strictly intended to be used by guildmates only. Any non-Thief who chooses to interact with these items will almost certainly face confrontation and possibly violent consequences from other players.
The following is an in-depth explanation of the rules and policies regarding these specific, Thief-only weapons. However, the concept can be summed up very simply for non-Thieves: if you don't want to get hurt, don't play with fire.
* The overarching rule: ANYONE who maintains possession of a Fade weapon, regardless of guild or profile stance, is at risk for PVP repercussions. You are a target as long as you hold onto these specific items, though decidedly less so as a guilded Thief. Therefore, if you wish to use Fade weapons in any way, it is HIGHLY recommended that you change your profile's PVP stance to GUARDED or OPEN.
* The ultimate goal of the Fade items is to allow containment and tracking to remain solely in the players' hands. This includes policing of non-Thieves by various techniques, not the least of which can include verbal and physical confrontation in either a single scenario or repeated conflicts over time. The bottom line is if a non-Thief does not want to be harassed, whatever the capacity, she should not ever be in possession of one of the Fade items.
* Thieves are encouraged to use verbal means to obtain contraband whenever possible, at least at the start. It is preferable that guild members use a logical escalation of tactics in order to reclaim a weapon from a non-Thief. While this is not mandatory, it reinforces the roleplay aspects of the scenario rather than just straight up killing people.
* Ample warning is provided to the non-Thief (through in-game messaging when handling an item and OOC information, such as this article) regarding the potential consequences. Frankly, you will be hit over the head with messaging, and this is intentional so that no one can claim ignorance. Any time a non-Thief comes in possession of a Fade weapon, she also is declaring the fact that she is willing to accept any and all consequences that may come from her actions. We do recognize the potential for abuse, so there are various mechanics that alert the non-Thief to the illicit item in her possession in case she inadvertently obtained it.
* Thieves will also have a way of detecting the items in the possession of other players, both fellow Thieves and non-Thieves alike, through a new facet of the MARK verb -- MARK ITEM. Upon successfully finding a non-Thief with a Fade weapon, the Thief must wait 7 MINUTES before taking any physical course of action. The reason for this is to ensure that players who are new, oblivious, or victims of trickery/deception are not being punished for accepting or possessing an item without being properly aware of the danger. If a weapon-carrying person is attacked before the 7 minutes is up, the Thief could potentially be at risk for a policy violation.
* In order to not "out" anyone, Thieves will only be able to discover if a player has one of the weapons via MARK ITEM, no other information about the target. Thieves should keep in mind that the main focus should be non-Thieves, not fellow guildmates. No one is required to "out" oneself if confronted about possession of a Fade weapon. However, at the same time, if loyalties are to be kept secret, then the weapon owner understands he still is at risk for potentially violent confrontation.
* Thieves who deliberately distribute Fade items to non-Thieves will also be at risk for punishment for betrayal, whether from the Guild itself or its members.
* Traders are considered responsible for any Fade weapon placed on their tables or auction blocks regardless of who actually "owns" the item.
* NO REFUNDS will be offered to non-Thieves who purchase a Fade weapon by mistake or without knowing the consequences. Caveat emptor.
* Thieves are free to confiscate weapons from non-Thieves if they wish as opposed to just forcing the target to dispose of the item. Thieves are also allowed to keep any weapon retrieved from a non-Thief. However, if the non-Thief wishes the item back, normal theft policies apply. Thieves will always have the upper hand, however, due to the exclusivity of the items.
* Despite all of the precautions developed, there is still the possibility for abuse of the system. Therefore, the GM Staff reserves the right to intervene in a conflict at any time and for any reason in order to make a judgment on how things are to proceed.
In summation, it will be repeated again -- If any of the above information is unsettling to you or is something you disagree with, simply do not involve yourself. Be conscientious of the items you purchase and possess, and you should not run into trouble if you do not wish to participate.
END NEWS ITEM
Dateline 5/17/2010: TRACKABLE THIEF-ONLY ITEMS
IC: Rumors abound of a new commercial enterprise stemming from the ruins of Throne City: a new merchant who sells goods to a very select clientele. Word has spread that these items are intended to remain in the hands of the worthy, and any outsider possessing one or more articles will certainly encounter trouble from the underground.
OOC: With the opening of GuildFest 2010 comes the release of King Fade's Back Alley Bazaar: a new shop exclusively for members of the Thieves' Guild. All weapons sold by this merchant are strictly intended to be used by guildmates only. Any non-Thief who chooses to interact with these items will almost certainly face confrontation and possibly violent consequences from other players.
The following is an in-depth explanation of the rules and policies regarding these specific, Thief-only weapons. However, the concept can be summed up very simply for non-Thieves: if you don't want to get hurt, don't play with fire.
* The overarching rule: ANYONE who maintains possession of a Fade weapon, regardless of guild or profile stance, is at risk for PVP repercussions. You are a target as long as you hold onto these specific items, though decidedly less so as a guilded Thief. Therefore, if you wish to use Fade weapons in any way, it is HIGHLY recommended that you change your profile's PVP stance to GUARDED or OPEN.
* The ultimate goal of the Fade items is to allow containment and tracking to remain solely in the players' hands. This includes policing of non-Thieves by various techniques, not the least of which can include verbal and physical confrontation in either a single scenario or repeated conflicts over time. The bottom line is if a non-Thief does not want to be harassed, whatever the capacity, she should not ever be in possession of one of the Fade items.
* Thieves are encouraged to use verbal means to obtain contraband whenever possible, at least at the start. It is preferable that guild members use a logical escalation of tactics in order to reclaim a weapon from a non-Thief. While this is not mandatory, it reinforces the roleplay aspects of the scenario rather than just straight up killing people.
* Ample warning is provided to the non-Thief (through in-game messaging when handling an item and OOC information, such as this article) regarding the potential consequences. Frankly, you will be hit over the head with messaging, and this is intentional so that no one can claim ignorance. Any time a non-Thief comes in possession of a Fade weapon, she also is declaring the fact that she is willing to accept any and all consequences that may come from her actions. We do recognize the potential for abuse, so there are various mechanics that alert the non-Thief to the illicit item in her possession in case she inadvertently obtained it.
* Thieves will also have a way of detecting the items in the possession of other players, both fellow Thieves and non-Thieves alike, through a new facet of the MARK verb -- MARK ITEM. Upon successfully finding a non-Thief with a Fade weapon, the Thief must wait 7 MINUTES before taking any physical course of action. The reason for this is to ensure that players who are new, oblivious, or victims of trickery/deception are not being punished for accepting or possessing an item without being properly aware of the danger. If a weapon-carrying person is attacked before the 7 minutes is up, the Thief could potentially be at risk for a policy violation.
* In order to not "out" anyone, Thieves will only be able to discover if a player has one of the weapons via MARK ITEM, no other information about the target. Thieves should keep in mind that the main focus should be non-Thieves, not fellow guildmates. No one is required to "out" oneself if confronted about possession of a Fade weapon. However, at the same time, if loyalties are to be kept secret, then the weapon owner understands he still is at risk for potentially violent confrontation.
* Thieves who deliberately distribute Fade items to non-Thieves will also be at risk for punishment for betrayal, whether from the Guild itself or its members.
* Traders are considered responsible for any Fade weapon placed on their tables or auction blocks regardless of who actually "owns" the item.
* NO REFUNDS will be offered to non-Thieves who purchase a Fade weapon by mistake or without knowing the consequences. Caveat emptor.
* Thieves are free to confiscate weapons from non-Thieves if they wish as opposed to just forcing the target to dispose of the item. Thieves are also allowed to keep any weapon retrieved from a non-Thief. However, if the non-Thief wishes the item back, normal theft policies apply. Thieves will always have the upper hand, however, due to the exclusivity of the items.
* Despite all of the precautions developed, there is still the possibility for abuse of the system. Therefore, the GM Staff reserves the right to intervene in a conflict at any time and for any reason in order to make a judgment on how things are to proceed.
In summation, it will be repeated again -- If any of the above information is unsettling to you or is something you disagree with, simply do not involve yourself. Be conscientious of the items you purchase and possess, and you should not run into trouble if you do not wish to participate.
END NEWS ITEM
<<I guess by confiscate they really mean the non-Thief willingly hand over the weapon. If they chose to play hardball there's nothing you can really do since you can't repeatedly kill them either or risk harassment.>>
In this particular situation I'm not sure that's true. The wording in the GM announcement seems to make Fade an exception to the standard harassment policy:
<<* The overarching rule: ANYONE who maintains possession of a Fade weapon, regardless of guild or profile stance, is at risk for PVP repercussions. You are a target as long as you hold onto these specific items... Therefore, if you wish to use Fade weapons in any way, it is HIGHLY recommended that you change your profile's PVP stance to GUARDED or OPEN.>>
Looks to me that a non-thief Fade user has a permanent Kick-Me sign on their back and has as their only recourse either PvP or lose the weapon.
Tiesse, help me out here please if I'm leading people astray.
Kaxis
http://www.tinyurl.com/kaxisforgedarmor
For my forged LC/HC, IM me at KaxisDR or visit Ciressa's tables in the Riverhaven Trader Market Building (from temple/town hall go: north, go building, up) on Mon, Wed, Fri, and one weekend day.
In this particular situation I'm not sure that's true. The wording in the GM announcement seems to make Fade an exception to the standard harassment policy:
<<* The overarching rule: ANYONE who maintains possession of a Fade weapon, regardless of guild or profile stance, is at risk for PVP repercussions. You are a target as long as you hold onto these specific items... Therefore, if you wish to use Fade weapons in any way, it is HIGHLY recommended that you change your profile's PVP stance to GUARDED or OPEN.>>
Looks to me that a non-thief Fade user has a permanent Kick-Me sign on their back and has as their only recourse either PvP or lose the weapon.
Tiesse, help me out here please if I'm leading people astray.
Kaxis
http://www.tinyurl.com/kaxisforgedarmor
For my forged LC/HC, IM me at KaxisDR or visit Ciressa's tables in the Riverhaven Trader Market Building (from temple/town hall go: north, go building, up) on Mon, Wed, Fri, and one weekend day.
